Libya: The Bizarro War
We’re killing civilians in order to save them
Note: Take a look at my commentary on the death of Osama bin Laden here.
Flying unopposed over Libyan airspace, NATO’s fighter planes bombed the residence of the Gadhafi family, killing his youngest son and three grandchildren. What a glorious victory for the defenders of innocent civilians! The NATO-crats, of course, deny targeting either Gadhafi or his family members: those much-touted high-tech weapons, with their “precision” targeting capabilities, seem to have had a very convenient breakdown. But at least one Republican Senator wasn’t fooled. Lindsey Graham had this to say:
“I support what NATO did. I thought this was a good use of the mandate. This is the way to end this [conflict]. Thousands of people are subject to dying, the longer this takes. No one in the world is going to regret Gadhafi being replaced, however you do it. I want to thank NATO for expanding the scope of these operations.”
“A good use of the mandate” – killing three grandsons of the Libyan dictator, all under the age of 12? And what about that “mandate,” which was proclaimed in the name of preventing civilian deaths in Libya’s civil war? In the Orwellian logic of “humanitarian” interventionism, raining death on 12-year-olds is an act of love. Welcome to Bizarro World: we hope you enjoy your stay.
Because it looks like we’re going to be trapped in this alternate dimension – where up is down and truth is lies – for quite a long time to come. Instead of crumbling like all the other Arab despots who face their day of reckoning, Gadhafi has survived – in some measure, I would argue, because of UN intervention. Without that, it’s likely the eccentric tyrant – although he might have temporarily retaken Benghazi – would’ve fallen victim to the same seismic forces that toppled his neighbors: Ben Ali, in Tunisia, and Egypt’s Mubarak. His regime was saved by the cavalry – the NATO bombers that are daily wreaking devastation on the Libyan people.
A thoroughly despicable – and, within the wider Arab world, hugely unpopular – tinpot dictator is fighting NATO to a draw. That has to earn him some credit on the Arab street – and in his own country, where the much-vaunted “tribes” show no signs of abandoning him.
As I predicted from the outset, the rebellion is a regionalist phenomenon, roughly centered in – but not confined to – Benghazi and the eastern part of the country. Libya was never a real country anyway, and so the rapid reversion to the ancient borders of Tripolitania (in the West) and Cyrenaica (in the East) is hardly surprising.
Yet the rebels – and their Western backers – are hardly content with half the pie. They want the whole thing, and that’s what this war is really about – it is a war of aggression by the de facto government of eastern Libya against the pro-Gadhafi Western half. Actually, the Gadhafi forces enjoy the support of two-thirds of the country if we include the Fezzan region, the source of many of the black African “mercenaries” Gadhafi is accused of importing.
This is why the Gadhafi regime has repeatedly called for a truce. Upon announcing the death of Gadhafi’s son, Seif, and the three grandchildren, Libyan government spokesman Moussa Ibrahim put it this way:
“This was a direct operation to assassinate the leader of this country. This is not permitted by international law. It is not permitted by any moral code or principle. If people claim they want to protect civilians, we have again and again declared, we are ready for negotiation, ready for road maps for peace; ready for political transitional periods; ready for elections; ready for referendum.
“NATO does not care to test our promises. The West does not care to test our statements. They only care to rob us of our freedom, our wealth, which is oil, and our right to decide our future as Libyans.”
This isn’t just a desperate ploy to buy time – Gadhafi really thinks he can win a national election, even one scrutinized in every detail by the UN. That’s a true megalomaniac for you. Well, then, why not take him up on his offer? After all, if Gadhafi is really the monster he’s now portrayed as being – as opposed to the rather rosy portrait of a “reformed” terrorist which took hold after he came in from the cold – then he’ll lose, big time, and the problem is solved without further loss of life.
Yet this scenario assumes the stated motivation behind the UN Security Council resolution authorizing military action – saving lives – has anything to do with NATO’s mission, which is nothing less than regime change. British Prime Minister David Cameron, apparently still suffering the aftereffects of celebrating The Wedding, defended the attack on the Gadhafi compound by telling the BBC the UN resolution permitted attacks on “command and control” targets because “their aim was to prevent a loss of civilian life by targeting Gadhafi’s war-making machine.”
They’re killing civilians in the name of protecting them: I suppose that’s good enough for government work.
If not for NATO, Gadhafi might very well be living in exile by now, writing his memoirs. Thanks to Western intervention, however – and please don’t tell me how the mighty army of Qatar is fighting alongside us – the Daffy Despot is showing some real staying power. Just how real remains to be seen, but the balance of forces on the ground, so far, seems to be perpetually favoring Gadhafi’s loyalists. This impression, it’s true, is due in part to the propagandistic nature of most war reporting: somehow, the rebels are always on the edge of disaster (and in dire need of more NATO assistance), and Gadhafi’s African mercenaries – pumped up with Viagra, according to our UN ambassador, Susan Rice – are always on the verge of taking some major city, murdering the males en masse, and raping all the women.
As has been the case for all the Arab dictators faced with the wrath of their own suddenly-awakened people, in Libya attempts to parlay have come from the regime. The Americans, who once urged restraint on the Egyptian masses – and endorsed Mubarak’s chosen heir, the former head of the Egyptian spy agency – think they have learned their lesson, and are now ahead of the game.
The game they are playing is a very dangerous one, tailor made to generate the sort of lethal “blowback” we saw on 9/11. Because their game involves lining up with the very enemy they claim to be fighting worldwide.
Abu Yahya al-Libi, a top al-Qaeda commander born in Libya, issued a statement supporting the rebels, and radical Islamists throughout the world are rallying to the cause. The last time we saw this NATO/al-Qaeda alliance in action was in the Bosnia and Kosovo conflicts, where NATO also intervened for purportedly “humanitarian” reasons. In the Balkans, al-Qaeda’s janissaries stood shoulder-to-shoulder with NATO forces, fighting to establish an Islamic beachhead in the heart of Europe: today the pattern is being repeated in North Africa.
I am reminded of the first paragraph of Michael Scheuer’s Imperial Hubris:
“As I complete this book, U.S., British, and other coalition forces are trying to govern apparently ungovernable postwar states in Afghanistan and Iraq, while simultaneously fighting growing Islamist insurgencies in each – a state of affairs our leaders call victory. In conducting these activities, and the conventional military campaigns preceding them, U.S. forces and policies are completing the radicalization of the Islamic world, something Osama bin Laden has been trying to do with substantial but incomplete success since the early 1990s. As a result, I think it fair to conclude that the United States of America remains bin Laden’s only indispensable ally.”
Scheuer meant this last comment in a purely metaphorical or objective sense, not that the US leadership was secretly colluding with bin Laden. This latest confluence of interests, however, verges on active collaboration – and there is nothing secret about it. A top rebel commander has admitted – or, rather, boasted – that he is fresh from fighting under al-Qaeda’s banner in Iraq.
In order to establish his Arab street cred, President Obama is cuddling up to Libya’s jihadists – and probably arming them, just like we support and arm Jundallah, the Sunni terrorist group operating in Iranian Baluchistan. With David Petraeus at the CIA, these kinds of covert wars are doubtless the wave of the Obama-ite future. The COIN doctrine goes global – and clandestine. Beyond congressional oversight and beneath the radar of our mainstream journalists, America’s covert wars are setting us up for a major conflict.
Prediction: More Republicans are going to suddenly discover the electoral benefits of opposing Obama’s Libyan gambit, a political hot-potato handed to him by old adversary Hillary Clinton and opposed by over 70 percent of the American people.
I’ll go further out on a limb and divine the coming political demise of Lindsey Graham: not all the warmongering in the world is going to save him from the wrath of Tea Party types who (rightly) consider him a leading RINO. He’s one of three US Senators who can be counted on to whoop the loudest for war at the start of any international crisis, the other two being Joe Lieberman and John “Boots-on-the-ground” McCain. A more desirable candidate for involuntary retirement from politics has never set foot on Capitol Hill.
NOTES IN THE MARGIN
Take a look at my commentary on the death of Osama bin Laden here.
Read more by Justin Raimondo
- BS in Baghdad – May 24th, 2012
- Interventionism and the Elites – May 22nd, 2012
- Obama or Anarchy? – May 20th, 2012
- What Does Ron Paul Want? – May 17th, 2012
- Hillary’s Terrorists – May 15th, 2012





Johnny in Wi.
May 1st, 2011 at 9:09 pm
Another great column Justin: Now that Bin Ladin is suppposedly dead the focus of the War on Terror can be pointed at Iran, Libya, Syria and who knows who else. The whole Middle east and Central Asia are now targets. Will the troops come home now? I don't think so.
Jan Burton
May 1st, 2011 at 9:17 pm
Justin,
the US said it was trying to save the people of Benghazi, not Ghadaffi`s family.
Thus far civilian casualties from air-strikes have been so low that the regime isn`t bothering to show any to the world.
That said, it still isn`t our war and we shouldn`t be there in any way
skulz fontaine
May 1st, 2011 at 9:21 pm
"Bizarro War" indeed. Well said Mr. Raimondo. And the NATO brass balls managed to bomb bejesus out of a 'school for Libyan Downs Syndrome' children. Cause you know, NOTHING says "terrorist" like Downs Syndrome children. Be they Libyan or whomever.
But and on an Obama high note, Usama bin Ladin is dead. Huzzah for the "global war of terror!" Only took the US brain trust almost ten years but, gots him. Yeah yeah, whatever.
Must be me but, I visualize US government policy and I all can "grok" is immorality.
Tiberius
May 1st, 2011 at 9:23 pm
I like the Heinlein reference at the end of your post.
Oswaldwasalefty
May 1st, 2011 at 9:44 pm
Doubtful Qaddafi will last as long as Bin Laden did on the run. Of course, Bin Laden was on the run and most likely got a lot of help from the locals in Pakistan. After nearly ten years they finally got him, and one must wonder how many people were killed in Afghanistan and Pakistan trying to find this guy.
It really doesn't really matter what any "mandate" authorizing the attack on Libya says on paper. What power in the world can do anything to the U.S. government if it decides to violate said "mandate". Of course, they're trying to kill Qaddafi and overthrow his government. They hate him and are grateful for the opportunity the Arab Spring has given them to get him.
"USA! USA! USA!" they're chanting outside the White House and probably in NYC. The humanitarian interventionists are going to be having a field day with this all the way until Election Day next year.
skulz fontaine
May 1st, 2011 at 9:49 pm
Thanks Tiberius. Ummm, that last line should read, "blah blah blah…and all I can grok is immorality." You'd think I would have caught that. I dislike the editing drill.
!WarNowThinkLater!
May 1st, 2011 at 9:56 pm
Our Peace-Laureate president will use Osama's death as an excuse to expand his drone-war adventures. Will our gutless Congress say no? Will the emboldened War Chief set his eyes on Iran?
Ira7Epstein
May 1st, 2011 at 11:07 pm
I think you hit on one of the major reasons for US intervention in Libya. You write that one of the possible outcomes of US intervention in LIbya is the strenghening of Al Qaida. I would suggest this is one of the unstated purposes of the intervention. It is a strong possiblity that the US government wants to strenghen Al Qaida in order to provoke another terrorist attack in the United States. Look how much power the US government gained by 911. Imagine if there was another attack equal to 911 how much more power the US government could sieze under the pretext of protecting innocent American life. It seems to me that the US government has everything to gain and nothing to lose by deliberately taking actions that will provoke a terrorist attack against innocent Americans
Ira7Epstein
May 1st, 2011 at 11:40 pm
Using R2P as a pretext, the US government through NATO or some other contrivance will soon be intervening in the internal politics of Syria. The Assad government is the major Arab ally of Iran, and a big supporter of Hamas and Hezbollah. The chance to overthrow the Assad government in some CIA engineered color coded revolution is just to tempting for the power elites in the United States government to resist. This statement in no way denies or disparages the right of the people of Syria to overthrow the Assad government in a homegrown revolutionary movement.
mickperry
May 2nd, 2011 at 1:12 am
Many people in the West will be viewing bin Laden's reported death with cynicism and also some healthy scepticism given all that we know, and still more, what we don't know about what happened on that fateful day. Here in England, the news arrived too late to make the national daily morning newspapers, and the main topic is still the murder of Gaddafhi's son and grandchildren from a NATO air strike. We have already begun to witness the reaction to this criminal attack playing out on the streets of Tripoli, but tomorrow the story will disappear as the presses roll out the tall tale of the heroic assault on bin Laden's compound, and it will be like the Royal wedding all over again, with countless pages of verbiage and even more pictures.
Obama's speech last night indicates a deep concern about how the news of bin Ladens death is received by the Muslim world, particularly in Pakistan itself, where bin Laden is not viewed in the same light as he is in the West. Following on the heels of the controversy surrounding CIA killer Raymond Davis, recently spirited out of the country after his arrest by Pakistan authorities, it is quite likely that bin Laden's death will be the spark that ignites an already deep resentment long festering inside that country.
It will be regrettable therefore if the President does not take this opportunity to demonstrate to the world that the US is a nation of compassion and mercy by announcing that Affia Siddiqui is to be returned to Pakistan to live out the rest of her life under house arrest. I can think of no other gesture that might repair and restore the US's moral standing in that part of the world. There's not a chance in hell of this happening of course, because the only consideration of any importance for these 'tough guy' US politicians is that they out do one another in trying to be seen as the staunchest defenders of their nation. Regrettably their obsession with their own fortunes means that they will remain oblivious as to how the rest of the world now views their country.
sherban
May 2nd, 2011 at 2:15 am
Raimondo contradicts himself in this article.Once he wrote:"A thoroughly despicable – and, within the wider Arab world, hugely unpopular – tinpot dictator is fighting NATO to a draw."
And some lines away he wrote,probably beginning to doubt about what himself established now as in some others articles dedicated to Libya war:"This isn’t just a desperate ploy to buy time – Gadhafi really thinks he can win a national election, even one scrutinized in every detail by the UN. That’s a true megalomaniac for you. Well, then, why not take him up on his offer? After all, if Gadhafi is really the monster he’s now portrayed as being – as opposed to the rather rosy portrait of a “reformed” terrorist which took hold after he came in from the cold – then he’ll lose, big time, and the problem is solved without further loss of life. " But who portrayed him as a "monster"?Raimondo between others even he (Raimondo)recognized that Gaddafhi has the support of 2/3 of libyan population.
Johnny in Wi.
May 2nd, 2011 at 3:00 am
How come Bin Laden is buried at sea with out any real examination of his body by family or independent people? I wonder what the real story is? The whole thing is fishy. The story is released just in time for the morning papers and a rent a mob is out in the streets in front of the Whitehouse to celebrate. It all stinks of showbiz.
tadzio
May 2nd, 2011 at 3:18 am
The endgame is chaos in the Arab world. It is the Clean Break agenda. The tip off was the sequestering of all Libyan property in the West. Obama et alii. did not want Gadhafi to go quietly.
Letting him and his family leave or, if you prefer, abscond with a billion or two to a life of leisure on the Riviera or Costa Del Sol would have been too cheap. No glory in that. Just thousands not killed, not maimed or not raped. It would have meant billions and billions of undestroyed property and billions of Pentagon dollars not wasted.
If a nation does not seek war it leaves a back door open. The traffic, however shabby, through it is always cheaper than war.
Emilyrose
May 2nd, 2011 at 4:10 am
Could I take this opportunity to grovel and apologise for believing for one moment – never mind a few days – that Cameron and NATO were even half sincere.
Unfortunately when I heard Gadaffi threaten to kill all in Benghazans with guns I was appalled and welcomed intervention. In fact that murderous statement probably made it impossible for Russia or China to veto the UN resolution so I was not alone in my horror.
So, stupidly because with the illegal attack and mass murder of the Serbs always in mind, I plunged into thinking that this was one occasion when the barbaric and merciless killers in an illicit NATO – which violates its own charter with each attack – were doing something to save lives rather than slaughter.
It soon became abundantly clear that I fell for the big con. I should have known better.
A sincere apology to Mr Raimondo and all those who rightly down arrowed me or thought I had taken leave of my senses.
I clearly did but with the best of intentions.
They say hope springs eternal – I can honestly say that NATO is now beyond hope.
Where do we go from here?
I hate to think with Israel's existence being threatened (thats positve!) but when we know that Israel has its nukes pointed at every European capitol and openly boasts that Europe goes down if Israel does – it isn't quite such a positive as all that.
I live not so far away from one of them!
Israel hasn't got its Georgian bolt hole ready yet – thanks to Russia – so it could turn the planet into an inferno.
Never underestimate a zionist. Zionists plural are the scourge of our world.
Things look grim.
don
May 2nd, 2011 at 4:28 am
Justin…you don't live in SC. Grahma knows there is a definate "Let's take their stuff" mentality when it comes to the middle east. My own brother agrees with Trump who claims he would take Iraq's oil for our efforts.( No mention of what he would do with the 30 million Iraqis.)
If FOX NEWS began a push to invade Mexico, there would be a collective rebel yell in SC.
"Let's kick us some Mexican ass and take their stuff !!!!"
Wootie Berster
May 2nd, 2011 at 4:30 am
Yes, Egypt.. the elephant in the equation. "NATO" (ie US Imperialism) needs the eastern part of Libya because it needs to be on the Egyptian border. Should I rather say "needs"? If those pesky Egyptian masses go green (which means something much different in the ME than here), and shakes spears at our good friends to the north.. well.. there "we" are.. poised like a highly mechanized, DU-tipped dagger at their backs. Say no more, say no more, nudge nudge, wink wink. "Listen, Egyptian folks.. dee-mocracy is all well and good and all.. BUT.. heh heh!"
Sam
May 2nd, 2011 at 5:24 am
It is wishful thinking to believe that the senoussis from Eastern Libya will be able to control West and South Libya. Besides the greater Sahara (Algeria,Mauritania,Mali,Niger,Tchad,Sudan) risks being destabilized.
Terrance&Philip
May 2nd, 2011 at 6:26 am
Agreed. If wikileaks taught us anything, it's that lying and deceit are today the SOP's of government.
Bodkin
May 2nd, 2011 at 6:41 am
"I know no one who rejoices in death."
Actually, it's quite common. People in Gaza distributed candies after two Arabs butchered a family of Jewish settlers a few months ago. Many across Arab and Muslim lands were dancing in the streets after 9/11. The killing of innocents in Israel and America always delights a large number of people who are eager to express their joy.
Osama bin Laden killed thousands of innocents and was presumably plotting the murders of even more. It's not surprising that his elimination would be greeted with jubilation or at least relief, especially in the nation he targeted above all others. I'm sure many Italians celebrated the death of Mussolini, as many Russians celebrated the death of Stalin, as much of the world celebrated the death of Hitler.
There's nothing shocking about Americans being happy to learn that the man who murdered thousands of their compatriots has been killed, and by a daring U.S. operation to boot.
Guildenstern
May 2nd, 2011 at 7:51 am
Do you really think Gadaffi's son and three grandchildren were killed? Sorry, but since just about every word out of the guy is a lie then I'll wait for verification before shedding a tear.
NATO says they hit a command and control center (http://www.nato.int/cps/en/SID-753BD290-17BBD6C5/natolive/news_72972.htm) and Lieutenant-General Charles Bouchard says they aren't targeting individuals. Personally, it's easier for me to believe the Canadian than the megalomaniac.
RED DAVE
May 2nd, 2011 at 7:58 am
Justin continues his fantasy that the Tea Baggers are somehow antiwar. Why don't you just give it up and join with them like you joined with the despicable Birchers?
RED DAVE
May 2nd, 2011 at 8:59 am
Just to add, accord to Slate, 70% of all Americans favor a no-fly zone in Libya; among Tea Baggers: 73%; 54% favor dirrect attacks on Gadaffi's forces; Tea Baggers: 73%.
There is absolutely no basis for an alliance between the left-wing antiwar movement and the right-wing Tea Party, on foreign or domestic issues.
http://www.slate.com/id/2288879/
RED DAVE
May 2nd, 2011 at 10:02 am
(1) Liberals and the left are not the same thing; get that straight.
(2) Ron Paul is a right-wing kook who would comnpletely destroy the social services that working people depend on. With Paul working people would have to choose between war and social services.
(3) Yes, Ron Paul is antiwar, but what does he do about it, except bray in public? Meanwhile, he is a card-carrying member of one of the two war parties.
Vojkan Milosavljevic
May 2nd, 2011 at 10:28 am
So, whiners, you see, I got censored, not because of Israel, but because I dared say to Americans what I think of their cowardice. Believe me, If I ever get in a position to choose, I'll spare a Jew over an American.
Rejoicing over anybody's death is shocking. The Serbian Orthodox Church ordered a fast in the aftermath of World War I, because killing, even in self-defence, is wrong.
Terrance&Philip
May 2nd, 2011 at 10:49 am
Yup it was worth every penny of the at least $400,000,000,000 (and counting) our misadventure in Afghanistan so far has cost us. To hell with educating the kiddies, making sure granny has insulin and people get to stay in their homes. Destroying several countries to get at one man sure was worth it. One more "victory" like this one, and we'll be in the crapper permanently.
(Shall we now call such "victories" Bushian or Obamanian instead of Pyrhhic?)
Oswaldwasalefty
May 2nd, 2011 at 10:58 am
Mission accomplished, right? The occupation of Afghanistan should end, right? No, of course not:
http://news.antiwar.com/2011/05/02/clinton-vows-w…
But Obama definitely should put on a military uni and parade around on the deck of an air craft carrier.
Bin Laden buried at sea: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Osama_bin_L…
andy
May 2nd, 2011 at 12:44 pm
We should have just minded our own business.
geo1671
May 2nd, 2011 at 12:58 pm
Justin–wise-up! What's with the hatred towards Gadaffi ?
"A thoroughly despicable – and, within the wider Arab world, hugely unpopular – tinpot dictator is fighting NATO to a draw"–you seem to post referances to back up hatred.
try this: Trying 'Shock and Awe' in Libya By Robert Parry April 27, 2011 http://www.consortiumnews.com/2011/042711.html–r… half way
When you have read it,please respond and allow us your opinion in comparing Bill Clinton and Daddio/Son Bushs or Blair. I'll take Gadaffi as a friend over these Devil's Rejects any day. Admit it–NATO is today's modern pirates.Please stop the B.S Justine and Osama has been dead 10 years ago and never had anything to do with the Kosher 911 attacks :^
Ira7Epstein
May 2nd, 2011 at 1:07 pm
If the number of innocent people killed by Bin Laden is put on one side of a scale and the number of innocent people killed by the US government's policy of aggressive war does anyone doubt which side will tip the scales?
Bodkin
May 2nd, 2011 at 2:25 pm
Well, it wasn't me who complained, but I still don't agree with you. I think it's human nature to cheer the death of the enemy. That doesn't put human beings in a very good light, but our flawed nature is what it is.
"killing, even in self-defence, is wrong" — Killing is always horrific and shocking, but I don't agree that it's "wrong" to judge your own life, or perhaps the life of a family member you're trying to save, above one who seeks to take it.
Pardon my ignorance, but I always thought Jews and Serbs had a bond (and a mutual enemy) because of what happened in WW2.
Bodkin
May 2nd, 2011 at 2:31 pm
To Terrance and Ira:
I wasn't justifying ten years of costly war. I was just saying that it's human nature to cheer the killing of a man who has been demonized as the great villain of the age.
The people celebrating probably don't think in terms of respective casualty counts, but rather intent. It was Osama's intent to kill thousands of sitting ducks, and he did. The celebrants don't believe it's been the intent of U.S. forces to slaughter innocents, but rather jihadists with the same goals as bin Laden.
GradyWilson
May 2nd, 2011 at 2:47 pm
"Justin continues his fantasy that the Tea Baggers are somehow antiwar." – Red Dave
That is his Bizarro World Libertarian 'logic' (propaganda). If Lindsey Graham does indeed meet a well deserved demise by the hands to the Tea Partiers it will be because of their hatred of homosexuals rather than their hatred of militant imperialism.
http://pewresearch.org/pubs/1812/dont-ask-dont-te…
" .. those who agree with the Tea Party are less supportive of allowing gays to serve openly .."
"Tea Partyers, according to yet another recent poll, are conservative Republicans." http://www.salon.com/news/politics/war_room/2011/…
GradyWilson
May 2nd, 2011 at 2:59 pm
"I think it's human nature to cheer the death of the enemy" – bodkin
But Americans are supposed to be exceptional and based on christianity. Has the exceptional christian nation turned the other cheek or sought unending disproportionate inhumane vengeance?
Luke 6:27-36
[27] "But I tell you who hear me: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, [28] bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you. [29] If someone strikes you on one cheek, turn to him the other also. If someone takes your cloak, do not stop him from taking your tunic. [30] Give to everyone who asks you, and if anyone takes what belongs to you, do not demand it back. [31] Do to others as you would have them do to you.
Bianca
May 2nd, 2011 at 3:15 pm
You meant to say our media is not showing any. Casualties are reported to UN, and are disturbing. Protecting some civilians by killing others, not supporting the faction we root for is twisted and evil. Soon, if we do not start teaching our kids and grandkids what is evil, we may wake up one day to find out that our new generations consist of the armies of clones serving hapilly the empire pursuits, and with just as non-existent moral bearings as their fictional models.
Teaching wrong from right is getting harder and harder, as everything can be justified, no matter how evil, no matter how disguisting.
And incidentally, I do not know where this "children under twelve" comes in. In fact, the children killed were all under THREE. The oldest was just under three, another boy was two, and a girl only four months old.
Bianca
May 2nd, 2011 at 3:32 pm
Totally Pyrhic victory. He has been irrelevant for a long time. Taliban in Afghanistan have zero relationship with Al-Qaeda, and the offshoots, conveniently named based on pleasant bureaucratic naming stanards, like the AQ in Arabian Penninsula, Mezopotamia or Maghreb, are inventions. The opposition in Yemen pretty much said that. Saleh goes, and AQ in Arabian Penninsula will not exist any more. Same with the one in "Maghreb". Tunisian dictator took full advantage of this "threat" to keep his country under control. So, unless there is another outrageous act, the concept will die with the dictators that needed it for their power-flexing. Doubt that it was necessary to get Bin Laden now, as opposed to few months ago, or few months later. It was convenient in order to counter the bad news from the funerals in Tripoli this Monday.
GradyWilson
May 2nd, 2011 at 3:35 pm
"So, in 100 years is it more likely that Muslims world wide will point to bin Laden is a brave "mujaheed" or that American parents will point to pictures of GWB and Cheney and urge their children to emulate those fine men? " -T&P
Very provocative question. But the more immediate morally repulsive thought is that today's parents are pointing to the sinister drone loving Nobel Peace Prize Prez as someone to emulate. MLK would hate this man IMHO. He is poisoning the minds of African-Americans who see themselves in him and want him to succeed regardless of his imperial actions. Is their any significant faction in American against USA#1 violent militancy?
musings
May 2nd, 2011 at 3:49 pm
Yeah, I'll believe it when the troops are in Times Square kissing anonymous men and women as their preference leans.
Bianca
May 2nd, 2011 at 3:51 pm
Catholic bishop in Tripoli has confermed the deaths. You would still believe NATO afer their extremely funny attempt at justifying why did they target a passenger train in Serbia just as it was going over a bridge, so that it will end up in the ravine below. Or why did they target a bustling marketplace in a small town — following the bombing with a new areal assault just as the ambulances arrived. There is too much of sick pleasure in targeting civilians to make one feel comfortable. As for myself, I can only pray. Our leaders are pure evil, our media whitewashes the evil and portrays it as something glorious. Let us only pray for our nation, our children and granchildren. Let us also start teaching them values that would defend their soul from the poison of soulless empire, and hope that they will find the way to avoid turning into soulless empire drones that laugh at people's suffereing, and enjoy grabbing what is not theirs, and treat everyone else on earth as lowly creatures not worthy of life and happiness. May God help us.
Vojkan M
May 2nd, 2011 at 4:50 pm
Since every comment I make has to go through censorship: you broke the bond in 1992. I still love you but I just don't trust you.
someoneionceknew
May 2nd, 2011 at 5:34 pm
I never heard a bad word said about Gaddhafi in "the region" except by westerners who were indoctrinated by oil company rhetoric. Libya was a success story for its people. nd that is precisely why he is an official designated enemy.
The greatest threat to the oligarchs is the threat of a good example. Capitalism is inherently unstable and unsustainable. It is a system of managed deliberate shortage. Anyone who has a system inimical to those aims gets the demonisation treatment.
Bodkin
May 3rd, 2011 at 10:56 am
Either my memory is failing or I'll have to plead ignorance again. Remind me: what happened in 1992? I've paid more attention to the Middle East than I have to recent European history. Was it something to do with Milosevic?
Sam
May 3rd, 2011 at 12:01 pm
Gadhafi is more than Gadhafi
Sam
May 3rd, 2011 at 12:27 pm
Some times Justin whom i like because he is antiwar is not logical. He underestimates the fascists who are against minorities, jews and gays.
Sam
May 3rd, 2011 at 1:17 pm
Give Africa the stolen billions back.
Bodkin
May 3rd, 2011 at 1:49 pm
Wow. It's people like you they have in mind when they warn about crazy conspiracy theorists not believing Osama was killed.
By the way, didn't you mention you live in Canada? Why aren't you out celebrating the stunning victory of the fiercely pro-Israel Stephen Harper?
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA !!!!!!!!
Vojkan M
May 3rd, 2011 at 3:24 pm
Angela Keaton isn’t moderating. I am. And you’re outta here. – TLK
Chas
May 3rd, 2011 at 4:36 pm
How about them dancing Israelis, didya forget about them ?
Chas
May 3rd, 2011 at 5:01 pm
It is truly amazing how OBL has managed to be(come) dead, yet one more time, just as there was beginning to be a hint of recognition in the MSM that all was not entirely as it should be with that "birth certificate" authored by a "ukulele".
That they've made another heroic pass over Qaddafi's house, or tent, or whatever, also warms the heart and ever further distracts from some nagging doubts, maybe.
Thomas
May 3rd, 2011 at 5:48 pm
:)
slobodan
May 4th, 2011 at 4:02 pm
NATO is "Killing the kids to protect kids". If they continue with this tempo, there will be no kids to protect.!
How is NATO making difference which kids should be on not to be killed ?
Imagine psychopath taking the gun in your neighborhood and killing three kids because he is "He is angry with something" and other people even government figures supporting his views. NO this is no way forward – Bomber pilot or the one who issued such an gruesome order should be shown in public and charged for crimes in same way as psychopath with the gun. Kids should play whatever they surname or religion is – they have nothing to do with anyone's political views.
This kids are dead now and they will never play again – Do you have children ?
Courtenay Barnett
May 8th, 2011 at 11:51 am
•Viewed through a lawyer’s eyes – there are 6 salient points concerning the so-called “ humanitarian intervention” in Libya:-
1. Fig-leaf cover of the law to promote war.
This military exercise in Libya, under the fig-leaf cover of UN Resolution 1973 was and remains a pre-existing crawling peg war plan; and in truth is naked aggression unleashed against the government of Libya.
2. An attack on Libyan sovereignty
The brazen attack on the sovereignty of the Libyan state is evidenced by the following:-
i) An assumption that the US/NATO has a right to violate sovereignty on the pretext of somehow protecting the persons in Benghazi, with a professed entitlement that the US/NATO can arm rebel groups in support of attacks on the established government in Libya – while de facto asserting that the government must remain impotent and allow the attacks and division of the country to take place.
Courtenay Barnett
May 8th, 2011 at 11:52 am
ii) A “humanitarian mission” started by launching over a hundred high technology missiles into a country to kill people while professing to be saving lives?
iii) Commandeering the wealth in billions of a sovereign nation’s bank assets while recognising a minority rebel group, setting out to export stolen oil, proclaiming that a rebel group is assisted in establishing its own central bank and simultaneously stirring up unrest in Libya by supplying arms, then rejecting peace talks as is the wish of the African Union.
These actions do not command any respect amongst decent and right-minded individual citizens throughout the world, nor by responsible nations in the international community. China and Russia, as permanent members of the Security Council are aware of the serious implications of further escalation of this Libyan war.
3. Credible global criticism of US/NATO actions
Intelligent, well informed and credible persons across the global can and have put to bed this “humanitarian mission” pretext and casus belli foisted on the international community: http://rt.com/news/nato-ground-operation-libya/
Courtenay Barnett
May 8th, 2011 at 11:53 am
4. Manifest imperialist war
This is a modern day imperialist war, and one of the most flagrant violations of the principles of sovereignty and the rule of international law that I have witnessed within the past decade. But, of course, there is the greater loss of life and the ruse of WMDs in Iraq, with now about a million dead to provide “better” precedent.
Courtenay Barnett
May 8th, 2011 at 11:53 am
5. Illegality of the assassination attempt on a national leader
By attempting to assassinate an established leader of a nation state, namely, Mommar Ghadaffi, there has been a further violation of the basic rules under the Hague Convention; Geneva Conventions and the established civilized principles under customary international law. Not even Article 53 of the Vienna Convention can sensibly permit the unleashing of war rationalised to be anticipatory self-defence. If so, all peace efforts can then readily be inverted into pre-emptive war making.
6. The United Nations was established to preserve and promote global peace – not war
We all need to remind ourselves that the purpose of the United Nations as stated at Article 1 of the its UN Charter is to “maintain international peace and security, and to that end, to take effective collective measures for the prevention and removal of threats to the peace, and for the suppression of acts of aggression or other breaches of the peace.” One cannot achieve peace by escalating war!