One of the many erroneous beliefs held by Imperial policymakers and their supporters is that history can end – and on their terms, no less. Back in August, German FM Guido Westerwelle told Belgrade that, “The map of southeastern Europe has been laid down and completed.”
Events of the past few weeks suggest that Empire’s allies in the Balkans never got Westerwelle’s memo.
Albania, Naturally
Last month saw the foundation of the “List for Natural Albania,” a pan-Albanian political movement helmed by former government adviser Koco Danaj. According to reports, the founding ceremony was attended by Albanian politicians from Kosovo, Macedonia, Montenegro, Greece, and southeastern Serbia – all territories that Danaj’s “Natural Albania” aspires to include. Danaj announced that the List would take part in elections in “all Albanian lands,” and expressed hopes that a “natural Albania” would be established by 2013 – exactly a century after the Treaty of London established the modern Albanian state.
The idea of gathering all Albanians into one polity is nothing new. It was pioneered by the League of Prizren in 1878 (albeit within the Ottoman Empire), and put into practice in 1945-45, under German and Italian sponsorship. For years, the Albanian-American Civic League featured a map of “natural Albania” in its masthead, as did many other organizations supporting “Independent Kosova” and the KLA.
NATO’s 1999 occupation of Kosovo on behalf of the KLA enabled subsequent Albanian insurrections in Macedonia and southern Serbia, which were suspended only after major concessions were extorted from both Skopje and Belgrade. Danaj has talked about the “natural Albania” since 2006, but that agenda become practically possible only after the provisional Albanian government of occupied Kosovo declared independence in February 2008 – and was recognized by Empire and its allies.
Though it runs counter to Empire’s official agenda, it is unlikely that Danaj’s initiative will face criticism or censure in Washington or Brussels. The Empire has dismissed for years the warnings of Greater Albania as nothing more than “Greater Serbian propaganda.” They also claimed, back in 1999, that NATO’s occupation of Kosovo didn’t mean the province’s separation from Serbia. Obviously, the Albanians seem to be an exception to whatever standards the Empire decides to demand from others.
One thing to note, however, is that Danaj’s support is much greater outside Albania proper; though he founded his party in Tirana, the political center of his future state – if it ever arises – would more likely be in Pristina.
Trashing Trianon
Hungary never reconciled with the provisions of the 1920 Treaty of Trianon, which defined its modern borders. As part of the Austro-Hungarian dual monarchy, Budapest laid claim to half of today’s Croatia, northern Serbia, parts of Slovakia and Romania (e.g. Transylvania). To reclaim at least some of those territories, Admiral Horthy’s regime allied with Nazi Germany in the 1940s. Today’s Hungarian government is allied with Brussels and Washington.
Earlier this year, Budapest passed a controversial citizenship law, extending citizenship rights to ethnic Hungarians anywhere. This has caused much friction with Slovakia and Romania, who are also EU and NATO members. Now there is word that even non-Hungarians living in “traditional Hungarian territories” may qualify for citizenship as well. This is raising havoc in Serbia’s northern province of Vojvodina, already plagued by separatism.
Negating Neuilly
Not to be left behind, Bulgaria is also demanding border revisions. November 27 was the anniversary of the 1919 Treaty of Neuilly-sur-Seine. Last year, a fringe Bulgarian political party (VMRO-BND) demanded the return of the territory ceded by that treaty to Serbia. This year, a major political party seized upon the issue. Ataka (“attack”), a self-confessed nationalist organization allied with the current government, organized demonstrations last weekend in eastern Serbia, and howled in protest when Serbian authorities stopped its MPs on the border.
The territories in question were ceded following the Great War, in which Bulgaria allied with the Central Powers and assisted in the Austrian and German crushing of Serbia in 1915. Parts of Serbia were under Bulgarian occupation 1915-1918, and again between 1941-45.
Chasing Moldavia
Romania is not without territorial aspirations, either. Bucharest sees the neighboring Moldova – once a province of Czarist Russia and part of Romania 1919-1940 – as a natural extension of the Romanian state. In a recent newspaper editorial, Romanian president Traian Basescu envisioned Moldova as part of Romania by 2035. However, some Moldovans claim a separate identity, and the ethnic Russians in the region of Transnistria reject both Bucharest and Chisinau.
Interests Eternal and Perpetual
To make the list complete, one should also note that the current Turkish government declared Turkey the “motherland” of all Balkans Muslims – an announcement greeted with enthusiasm in Muslim-dominated parts of Bosnia and western Serbia.
Obviously, Empire’s notion of finalizing the Balkans map is not shared by its clients in the region. Instead, they seek to capitalize on their favored status to achieve their interests. This is precisely what happened in the 1940s, when Albania, Bulgaria, Hungary and Romania became allies of Hitler’s Germany. To borrow a phrase from Lord Palmerston, these interests are “eternal and perpetual.”
There are several things worth noting in this bleak political landscape. First of all, territorial aspirations are made against countries that are weak. Hungary is not demanding half of today’s Croatia, because Zagreb has strong German and Austrian support. Instead, it is going after Serbia, whom anyone can seemingly dismember with impunity these days. Bulgaria is doing the same – demanding territory from Serbia, but not from Greece. In Romania’s case, it is leveraging its position in EU and NATO against the weak and poor Moldova.
Only the Albanians are directly challenging other Imperial protectorates – Macedonia, Montenegro, and even Greece – in addition to demanding more territory from Serbia. This is probably due to their perception as the most favored Imperial client in the region, allowed to get away with almost anything.
History as Warning
For the past 20 years, the Empire has blamed all the ills in the Balkans on the “evil” regime of Slobodan Milosevic in Belgrade. Yet the Albanian claims go back to 1878, almost a century before Milosevic appeared on the Serbian political scene. Nor does Milosevic have anything to do with desires to restore the Ottoman Empire, Greater Hungary, “Romania Mare” or Greater Bulgaria.
Throughout the 19th century, but most notably between 1876 and 1914, major European powers butted heads over the Balkans, going so far as to bolster the failing Ottoman Empire rather than allowing Balkans peoples who might favor another power to win their freedom. The undisputed master of this game was Germany’s first chancellor, Otto von Bismarck, who was well aware of the dangers of meddling in the region. On two occasions, in 1876 and 1888, Bismarck argued:
“I am opposed to the notion of any sort of active participation of Germany in these matters, so long as I can see no reason to suppose that German interests are involved, no interests on behalf of which it is worth our risking – excuse my plain speaking – the healthy bones of one of our Pomeranian musketeers.”
Kaiser Wilhelm II ignored the warning and set off the Great War, which destroyed both him and most of Europe. In the 1990s, however, an envoy of the modern Empire cavalierly dismissed any historical considerations when dealing with the Balkans. Perhaps it is due to this hubris that the Empire now finds history not ending, but rather repeating itself – even as it is growing increasingly powerless to do anything about it.
Read more by Nebojsa Malic
- Victory Day – May 10th, 2013
- Consenting to Rape – April 25th, 2013
- An Unexpected Refusal – April 12th, 2013
- Lawless: An Oddly Exceptional Empire – March 28th, 2013
- Illusion of Triumph – March 21st, 2013





Ioan T
December 4th, 2010 at 12:56 am
"In Romania’s case, it is leveraging its position in EU and NATO against the weak and poor Moldova. "
-this was your most idiotic comment to date. I am from Moldova and 95% of us
feel more Romanian than the Romanians in Romania proper. That f-ing Russia decided to
break us appart from Romania doesn't make us less Romanians. Moldova is just a province of Romania that became separated against its will. It is like saying that Albertans and Canadians
are different nations. Albertans are Canadian and Moldovans are Romanian you moron.
Just because the Montenegrins are a bunch of traitors doesn't make them less Serbian. We on the other hand never forgot what we are. We are Romanians you bastard.
Stanley
December 4th, 2010 at 6:52 am
I was under the impression that Transylvania province of Romania + Moldova used to be Bessarabia during the Czarist Russia – yes with much in common with Romania but with considerable differences as well. Cluj and Timisoara seem to have a good number of Serbs and Hungarians in the Banat province if I am not mistaken (Western Romania – which has very little in common with Moldova).
Stanley
December 4th, 2010 at 6:54 am
In either case the impotent Western powers riddled with traditional, historical and proud homosexual tradition (from the Roman times to present day) are unable to stop the Albanian runaway train. That will be left to Serbians, Russians, Macedonians and Montenegrins. Of course that other nation's blood is always cheaper.
3oka
December 4th, 2010 at 8:18 am
Ioan I know a guy from Moldova who would disagree with what you have just said.
And watch your language Mr. Malich didn't deserve that that's for sure.
And by the way which part you dislike the most? Let me guess 1942 – 1945, right?
MichaelKenny
December 4th, 2010 at 9:21 am
A ha! The attack on the euro has obviously failed! The "silly little thing in the Balkans" is being hyped again! Kaiser Wilhelm and all! And Moldova seems to be the current target. A very similar article appeared on another website yesterday, right down to the Pomeranians! History does not, in fact, repeat itself and the more past wars are hyped, the more Europeans see the need for the EU! Thus, regardless of what happens to the American Empire, Europe will continue to go forward, not backward to yesterday's battles.
conumishu
December 4th, 2010 at 9:54 am
Mr. Malic, while I understand your intention to offer an integrated view on imperial politics, you got a bit carried away.
I'm Romanian from Romania and no doubt subjective on the matter, but the Moldovan "separate identity" ( i.e. different from Romanian identity) is quite a naive assessment. There is a Russian and Ukrainian minority in today's Republic of Moldova, about 1/3 of the population, and certainly many of them would prefer a return to the old ways of the Soviet empire. But the Romanian majority there will eventualy bring the province back into the Romanian state. 2035 is probably a simple estimate. The Russians there have a problem, many came with no intention of taking roots, as retirees or Soviet administration. While the Romanian majority is strong as it is now, in the future it's going to be even stronger. Historical right + ethnic majority = just a question of time.
conumishu
December 4th, 2010 at 9:55 am
(continued)
In fact, if it wasn't for that strip of land beyond Nistru river, Rep. Moldova teritory would have been already included into Romania. With Russia's consent too. Russia is interested to preserve a foothold east of Nistru and doesn't care for the rest of Rep. Moldova's fate while the Occidental empire loathes the idea of a new Kaliningrad/Konigsberg enclave.
As we are now part of the Occidental empire would you expect us to play the Russian card or the US/EU one? The moment the West gives the green light for a possible secession of "Transnistria", the integration of the territory this side of the Nistru into Romania would be a matter of weeks. For now, US/EU don't know how to prevent Russia from acquiring that strategically placed strip of land if it is allowed to secede, so it's a stalemate until cultural and economic forces will have their way.
conumishu
December 4th, 2010 at 10:19 am
You are mistaken. Ny the way, Cluj is far from Banat and has practically no Serbs, while Timisoara is in Banat and has very few Hungarians.
From a Hungarian point of view, they'd like others to believe there are significant differences between Romanians depending which part of their country they inhabit. Well, there aren't, if you want to believe a Romanian. No matter what region of Romania you're thinking of, there's no way you'd find some kind of northern Italian league (or similar movement) based on different "mentalities".
We bicker a lot and love to hate our poltiical class and often cast a very critical eye on ourselves or make jokes, but we have a strong national identity and unity. Of course, you don't have to take my word for it, just wait for some significant development that would prove me wrong. But be prepared for a very, very long life.
conumishu
December 4th, 2010 at 10:19 am
You are mistaken. By the way, Cluj is far from Banat and has practically no Serbs, while Timisoara is in Banat and has very few Hungarians.
From a Hungarian point of view, they'd like others to believe there are significant differences between Romanians depending which part of their country they inhabit. Well, there aren't, if you want to believe a Romanian. No matter what region of Romania you're thinking of, there's no way you'd find some kind of northern Italian league (or similar movement) based on different "mentalities".
We bicker a lot and love to hate our poltiical class and often cast a very critical eye on ourselves or make jokes, but we have a strong national identity and unity. Of course, you don't have to take my word for it, just wait for some significant development that would prove me wrong. But be prepared for a very, very long life.
conumishu
December 4th, 2010 at 10:53 am
Basarabia is a name extension, it was used to designate a small region above (and possibly including) the Danube delta. But yes, today's Rep. of Moldova territory (minus the trans-Nistru/Dniester strip) plus the part above the Danube delta which is now in Ukraine, is commonly refered as Basarabia.
Moldova is a medieval Romanian state, which included the lands between Eastern Carpathian mountains and Nistru river, south went to the Danube Delta and north included the land until above Cernauti(Chernovitz).
conumishu
December 4th, 2010 at 10:53 am
(continued)
Simplifying, the land between Prut and Nistru, roughly today's Rep. of Moldova, was taken by the Russian empire in 1812, the new state of Romania [1859 - Moldova (what's left of it, west of Prut river) and Valahia unite, gains independence from the Ottomans (1877-1878) fighting along the Russians, becomes a kingdom (1881) ] enters WW! alongside Antante in 1916, is forced to accept peace with Germany in 1917 after the Russians collapse under Soviet revolution but takes advantage of the favorable circumstances arised and takes back Basarabia in 1918 (confirmed by peace treaty in 1920), never recognized by the Soviets though initially Lenin approved the national liberation movements, lost again in 1940 after a Soviet ultimatum, reconquered between 1941-1944 in the WW2, lost again in 1944 (and by peace treaty – 1947).
Today's Rep. of Moldova declared independence from USSR in 1991. The strip beyond Nistru attached to it is a Soviet invention.
paleo
December 4th, 2010 at 11:10 am
In my view Moldova:Romania is like Montenegro:Serbia. An artificial state. Montenegro created based on a medieval polity and the Western objective of blockading Serbia from reaching the Adriatic. Moldova is likewise an artificial Russian-engineered entity. I can understand many Romanians wanting to reintegrate with Moldova, and vice versa.
Putting Transnistria/Trandniester into Moldova made no sense, since the region was historically more Slavic and is geographically more contiguous with western Ukraine than Moldova. It's the same game as putting Nagorno Karabakh (Armenian, historically and demographically) in Azerbaijan or gifting Russian Crimea to Ukraine. The usual Communist manipulation of divide and conquer.
I would have no problem with seeing Moldova without Transdniester reintegrated into Romania, if that's what most of them want.
paleo
December 4th, 2010 at 11:12 am
Do you think the Russian control over Transdniester is what is preventing reunification? In that case, why doesn't Moldova voluntarily cede the territory to Russia and release itself of that weight? Would they do it if it weren't for Western pressure, or are they refusing to do so because they want the territory?
paleo
December 4th, 2010 at 11:15 am
Perhaps he was mistaken. No need to get so bent out of shape. If anything, the controversial history of Yugoslavia (and the lies) informs us that we need a ton of information to properly understand a situation and the historical/demographic basis behind it. Most on this board are less acquainted with Romania or USSR issues than Yugoslavia issues, so it would be better to politely inform us (as Conumishu does) than throw insults.
conumishu
December 4th, 2010 at 11:20 am
Aside the strong language which you have no excuse for, I mostly agree with you including the "95% of us feel more Romanian than the Romanians in Romania proper" <- my own feeling.
And I might add, the Serbs in Kosovo are no less Serbs than those in Serbia proper, even if some call them Kosovars. And I bet you could find a handful who call themselves Kosovars too.
conumishu
December 4th, 2010 at 11:25 am
And why don't you enlighten us about the 1942-1945 riddle?
TsarSamuil
December 4th, 2010 at 11:38 am
This is nonsense, always trying to make Serbia look the victim vs Empire.
The fact of the matter is that Serbia was Empire's pet for many years and gulped up non-ethnic Serb lands and I would dearly like Nebojsa Malic to explain why Bosilegrad and other majority Bulgarian regions that Serbia recieved on a silver platter after ww1 should be in Serbia?
It is hypocritical to point at Albanians, when Serbians enjoyed that position before. While Austria was enemy of Serbia in ww1, it was their ally in the Serbo-Bulgarian war. Serbia told to turn their gaze towards Bulgaria because Austrians didn't want Serbs to concentrate on Austria stealing Bosnia. So, Serbia backstabs and invades Bulgaria in 1878 after Bulgaria reunites with Eastern Rumelia (majority Bulgarian region under Ottoman control). Empire didn't like Bulgaria doing that n sent loyal Serbia on the attack that marched towards Sofia, Bulgarian capital, despite that Bulgaria has no Serbian minority even.
It was Empire, England & France that fought on the side of the Ottoman Empire against Russia in the Crimean war and for centuries Empire propped up the Ottomans against Russia & Balkan Christians. After the Russo-Turkish war 1878, Bulgaria became the number one enemy of Empire because of its ethnicity was at the Aegean, scaring Empire of Russian navies in the Mediterranean. After San Stefano treaty followed Treaty of Berlin with carving up Bulgaria, from which Serbia received its first piece. For Russia, Bulgaria became a dead end and was dropped to fend for itself.
Despite Russia officially started siding against Bulgaria by trying out to see how policies would progress with Serbia instead, Empire, Russia's new allies, never trusted Russia in fully forgetting about Bulgaria and so used Bulgaria's neighbors to keep carving up Bulgaria.
After Treaty of Berlin, Serbo-Bulgarian war followed, after that came 1st Balkan war where Empire supported Serbia to break up the Balkan League by making a seperate alliance with Greece against Bulgaria who was the biggest participant and backbone of the League. Just counting the army, it was larger than Serbia's and Greece combined. It fought on the main front, lost much more men than any other of the League, by itself Bulgaria destroyed over half of the Ottoman divisions. Bulgaria payed the highest cost of all, while it was busy in Thrace, the Serbian-Greek alliance would selfishly divide the spoils while the Bulgarians did the heavy war-effort for the League. Serbia n Greece more than doubled their countries size but Bulgaria having done most contribution was reward with very little. To counter a break up of the League Bulgaria made a deal with Serbia how to divide Macedonia, despite it being mostly Bulgarian (most were followers of Bulgarian church, fact, not opinion). Ofc loyal pet of the Empire, Serbia signs and the very next day breaks agreement and marches over the agreed upon border, sparking Bulgarian outrage and 2nd Balkan war.
Empire steps in after and awards Bulgarian lands to its neighbors. In comes Germany that presents itself as a counterweight against Empire that keeps carving up Bulgaria. Russia keeps siding with Empire so it's no choice. Enter ww1 and circumstances pretty much determine who Bulgaria can ally with, unless it wants to ally with Empire which considers the very existence of Bulgaria a threat. It's ironic how Russian Tsar, who used to fight against Empire, writes a letter calling Bulgaria's move treason, just because Bulgaria fights Empire. Also, another irony is that he said Bulgaria betrays Slavs, while in his letter he lines up many of his titles, like Tsar of POLAND.
Russia chose to side with Empire against us, we have nothing to apologize for fighting for our very existence. Had Bulgaria given up, Bulgaria wouldn't exist today.
Serbia gets even more Bulgarian land after ww1, same after ww2.
While on the other hand Romania was given by Empire Southern Dobrudja, majority Bulgarian, it ended up ceding the territory, which was the right thing to do. But apparently Nebojsa Malic doesn't believe in doing the right thing. This despite that Serbia ceded territory to FYROM a few years ago (Kosovo Albanians protested because they wanted it for themelves). So, if Serbia could do that with Fyrom, then it can do the same for Bulgaria.
We are talking about lands that are majority Bulgarian. This is unlike Vojvodina where Hungarians are a minority, ceding that wouldn't make any sense.
Bulgaria has since 1878 tried to reunify its lands, and every year protests about Serbia's ww1 theft. This has nothing to do with whether Serbia is weak or strong. Why Greece doesn't receive similar protest is because their assimilation policies were much more brutal and successful, there's no clear territory that could be ceded. Same with Turkish Thrace, only a small Bulgarian minority exists.
TsarSamuil
December 4th, 2010 at 11:45 am
I would also like to mention that Serbia early on recieved before treaty of San Stefano, Nis, whose inhabitants had willingly chosen years before to join the Bulgarian Exarchate Church. The borderlands between Serbia and Bulgaria have been contested and the populace are a bit of both, but they chose Bulgarian Orthodoxy, but Empire gave it to Serbia. That and Macedonia having been Serbia's toy to deBulgarize it for a century or so. Add Stalin's plan to not only set up a Macedonian nation but also a Thracian and Dobrudjan one = Genocide of Bulgarian nation. You can perhaps get a feeling that Bulgarians aren't exactly happy about loosing control and lands, and would protest against Treaty of Neuilly, regardless of Empire, Serbia being strong or weak.
Our brave people, revolutionaries in IMRO faced down the might of the Ottomans and Empire for many years, so if you want to show your ignorance n think would sit meekly and accept theft of our lands if Serbia was in a strong position now, then I say that you, Nebojsa Malic, are delusional.
conumishu
December 4th, 2010 at 11:56 am
I think West dislikes the idea the Transnistria/Transdniestr will ask to become part of Russia.
The communists, actually Voronin who was president supported by them, which are viewed as backed by Russia already proposed amending the constitution to change Moldova into a federative state, to allow a referendum for seccession in Transnistria in case of unification with Romania.
There's also an "unofficial" Russian proposal (back in 2005 I think) called the Belkovski plan which favors the same outcome, reunification with Romania except for the strip.
There are Romanians beyond Nistru but that's not a real issue. The current position of both Romania and its EU supervisors is to maintain the strict legalism, meaning Moldova is sovereign, recognised, inviolable, etc. Which, of course, it didn't apply for Serbia in Kosovo.
Yes, Montenegro is a valid comparison, as it was east Germany to west Germany, and there are other examples.
paleo
December 4th, 2010 at 12:03 pm
TsarSamuil: the only example of Serbian aggression against Bulgaria was the Serbo-Bulgarian war, which lasted two weeks and involved no more than hundreds of casualties on either side.
In contrast, Bulgaria has attacked Serbia three times in the 20th century: 1913, 1915, and 1941 and assisted NATO during the 1999 bombing.
Bulgarian pretensions to all Serbian territory up to the Morava River is what is sick. Maybe it's time you idiots wrapped your head around the fact that we do not consider ourselves Bulgarian and don't want your "culture" shoved down our throats! Nor your atrocities. Read about the Toplica uprising and all that: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ostatky_Srbů_p…
Bulgaria was always the whore of the Balkans. First with the Russians during the Ottoman empire (which was legitimate, mind you, nobody would blame them for that).
Then backstabbing Serbia and Greece one year after they were allies against Turkey (1912 > 1913).
Then making an alliance with the old enemy Turkey and the German invaders in 1915-1918 and rampaging Serbia.
Then working with the Hungarians and Italians and Croats to try to destroy Serbia and assassinating the Serbian king in Marseille.
Then again being in the Nazi camp in 1941-1944 and rampaging Serbia, Vardar Macedonia, and Greece.
Then again with the Russians in 1944-1980s, even begging the USSR to annex Bulgaria!
Then back with Germany and now a member of NATO and the EU and quick to recognize Kosovo as an independent state when their neighbors Greece and Romania haven't.
I expect if NATO/EU goes down, Bulgaria will be in an alliance with Muslim Turkey or "mother" Russia again, and will again try to annex Nis or Belgrade or Thessaloniki or whatever else their greedy insatiable appetites lust over.
conumishu
December 4th, 2010 at 12:07 pm
(continued)
Transnitria was invented after the Soviet took power, between the world wars, I think 1924, not sure, as the embrio of the future Soviet Moldovan Republic. Purely imperial strategy, not unlike the methods used by the Tsarist Russia in its time.
While the spread of ethnic Romanians extended further to the east, they are becoming lost or assimilated into the Slavic population. Not to mention the massive dislocations that also affected Moldova during the Stalin era.
Also, the historical political and practical boundary to the east was the river Nistru/Dniestr, as even the line of castles extending from the White Citadel (Cetatea Alba) at the Black Sea all along the river, prove it. All of them "this" (west) side of the river. They were meant to defend and warn in time against Tartars raids.
conumishu
December 4th, 2010 at 12:09 pm
(continued)
The Russians recognised the Moldova borders when they were far from them. Peter the Great included. In its ill fated attempt to strike the Ottomans he allied Dimitrie Cantemir of Moldova, they lost, Cantemir was deposed, and the event practically marked the begining of a dark era for both Moldova and Valahia, since the Ottoman empire broke the agreement with the Romanian countries and no longer respected the rule of having a prince of the land as ruler. No wonder that 100 years later, Ottoman empire ceded half of Moldova to Russia like it was their own territory, which it never was. But, as I was saying, from a distance, Russia had no problem to confirm Moldova borders. When they got to the border they changed their mind.
TsarSamuil
December 4th, 2010 at 12:55 pm
Paleo, you are pathetic, I explained very well what happened in the 1st Balkan War, I see you didn't deny any of the facts. Serbia broke the Balkan League by making a seperate alliance with Greece against Bulgaria because Serbia didn't want to continue the war against the Ottomans in Thrace & Asia Minor because Serbia doesn't care about a war very far away from Serbia. Thanks to Serbia's selfishness the Ottomans didn't loose Constantinople, Thrace, Asia Minor. They were given a moment so they could survive create Turkey, simply because Serbia was Empire's pet and would rather start a petty inter-Balkan struggle over lands than defeat the Turks, and lands who were mostly Bulgarian Orthodox.
We did not claim any lands that weren't already part of the Bulgarian exarchate Church. I would like remind you that Serbia was initially in favor of the Russian San Stefano Bulgaria because it was a mostly a mirror image of the extent of the reach of Bulgarian exarchate church lands. “Bulgaru is united” Serbia said.
At the Council in Constantinople, Ottoman christians could freely vote to if they wanted to join the Bulgarian Exarchate church. Those who did so, were in this map. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Bulgarian-Exarc…
It was their democratic choice, however it was not their choice once Serbia took over some of those lands, that Serbia would banish their Bulgarian clergy and replace it with Serbian.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Bulgaria-SanSte…
Map of San Stefano Bulgaria, which didn’t include Nis, which was Bulgarian Orthodox, BY CHOICE. Treaty of Berlin gave more lands to Serbia, cities like Pirot. So, that’s two times Serbia steals lands, even BEFORE the Serbo-Bulgarian war.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d…
Here you can not only see the results of the first Balkan War, but also the agreed upon what should have been border between Serbia n Bulgaria. Notice a certain someone has move over the border? March 13 1912 Serbia agreed with Bulgaria the border, March 14 Serbia crossed the border… demanding more land n change to treaty. Not only did Serbia lie to Bulgaria, it lied to Greece that didn’t even know the Serbo Bulgarian treaty existed, so when hostilities happened, Greece didn’t know Serbia had broken the treaty and got caught up in war against Bulgaria. Greece would much rather have continued the war with Bulgaria as an ally and marched on Constantinople, but Serbian narcissism ruined the Balkan League. Serbia backstabbed Orthodoxy, saved the Turks as a side-effect and doomed the Armenians to fight a loosing battle which ended in an Armenian genocide, simply because Serbia didn’t want to continue the war.
Turkey in ww1 wasn’t the Balkans scene, Turkey didn’t attack Serbia, also you forget that Turkey n Serbia however were on the same side in 2nd Balkan war, which was a Balkan War and you fought on the side of the Turks vs a Christian Orthodoxy country, for land grabs. Turkey in ww1 was middle east scene fighting mostly against England, so why do you bring them up?
Your king, supported the Serbs who shot a Croatian MP in PARLIAMENT simply because he exerchised his democratic right for free speach. He said that the pan-Slavic movement that created the Kingdom of Slovenia, Croatia and Serbia was being turned into a Greater Serbia country, where the King strikes down on democracy and installs dictatorship. Almost all government workers, military officers were SERBIAN. Alexander starts brutal Serbianization campaing, this is what sparks retaliation which ends with his death, and it turned panSlavic Croats to some creating Ustasha which is the mirror opposite. Good job Serbs! You manage to screw up everything…
Bulgaria fought since Serbo-Bulgarian war to ww2 ONLY on lands where Bulgarians were a majority. We weren’t running around in Bosnia, northern Serbia where no Bulgarians live, so pray tell, what the HELL were you Serbs doing on lands that were majority Bulgarians and why are you acting so suprised that it sparked conflict? Following the same, that we only argue about lands who are mostly Bulgarian, notice that this article talks about no other lands in Serbia, why is that? Why didn’t we EVER fight for Belgrad? We named the city, had it for centuries, had it longer than Serbs have had it, yet we never asked for it back, why? Because it’s Serbian today, we only ask for where Bulgarians are majority, not like Serbians, who take lands where few or no Serbs at all live.
Hitler is Serbians best tool, they only have to say his name because his vile persona is a good cover for their own Serbian crimes.
TsarSamuil
December 4th, 2010 at 1:08 pm
Treaty of Neuilly, http://www.novinite.com/media/images/2009-11/phot…
This is what we want back, Bulgarians are a clear majority, in Bosilegrad for example Serbs are like less than 10 percent, overwhelmingly 70% are Bulgarian AND these figures are from Serbia itself.
Demanding Belgrad indeed! What a clown you are.
Eastern Frontiers - history repeating itself in the Balkans
December 4th, 2010 at 1:10 pm
[...] Frontiers – history repeating itself in the Balkans Eastern Frontiers by Nebojsa Malic — Antiwar.com A sense of deja vu from this part of the world. It seems that not only is Albanian nationalism is [...]
paleo
December 4th, 2010 at 1:11 pm
My grandfather was born in the outskirts of Aleksinac. Look how far that is from Bulgaria's border? http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f…
In 1915 his aunt was murdered by Bulgarian invaders, his little brother and sister died of disease. He was 5 years old and Bulgarian troops lined him up alongside his mother and other people in the village of Glogovica and wanted to execute them and throw their bodies into the Morava. They were saved by an Austrian colonel of Serbian origin (a Krajina man) who told the Bulgarians that they couldn't just kill women and children like that. My grandfather and his mother fled to her native village on Mt. Ozren, above Aleksinac. When the Austrian forces left, the Bulgarians came back and conducted a massacre anyway.
My grandfather lost both siblings and an aunt and had his house burned down by Bulgarian swine during WWI. And you know what: there were and are ZERO Bulgarians in Aleksinac. And the first *Serbian* uprising took place in Nis, so that tells you how much those people thought they were Bulgarian in the 19th century. Maybe Kosovo was "really" Bulgarian and Prince Lazar and Tsar Dusan were simply deluded into thinking they were Serbs.
You can take your filthy rabid garbage and put it you-know-where.
TsarSamuil
December 4th, 2010 at 1:44 pm
If you had paid the least bit of attention with my map of Bulgarian Exarchate church then you wouldn't talk about Bulgarian POLITICAL border, because todays Serbia n Bulgaria border doesn't show the end of the Bulgarian nation, which does extend into Serbia.
You want sympathy, are you kidding? Nis was Bulgarian before it was forcibly Serbianized, it had BY CHOICE chosen the Bulgarian Church, plz inform the readers how you "convinced" the Bulgarian clergy to leave from the people who had voluntarily chosen them? It was your practise for decades to hunt down and murder Bulgarian clergy n intelligentsia, that explains why Macedonia is now mostly filled with idiots who imagene they are descendants from Alexander the Great.
Have you forgotten about the Bulgarian uprising in Nis against the Ottomans, or does Serbia pretend it never happened? Oh wait, Serbia disbanded all Bulgarian revolutionary movements once Serbia took control over former Ottoman lands. And so when other Bulgarian revolutionaries fought later in Illinden uprisings, Serbia closed its border and as a result the Ottomans butchered thousands and thousands of Bulgarian civilians, because they couldn't get away. While on the other hand when Serbia earlier was getting liberated, its much more powerful n sympathetic neighbors allowed Serbs to cross border n get training n arms.
When Bulgaria got liberated, got carved up by Empire, treaty of Berlin, it was lonely and surrounded by enemies, Russia had other matters which favored it be allied with Empire…so when Bulgaria needed help, Serbs start Serbo-Bulgarian war…
1st Balkan war, we do the biggest war effort, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Bulgarian_Army_…
Strength, Bulgaria’s army more than Serbia n Greece combined
Bulgaria 350,000+,
Serbia 230,000 men,
Greece 125,000 men
Casualties and losses, Bulgaria by far most casualties, and inflicted most on the Turks
Ottoman Empire:
50,000 killed
100,000 wounded
115,000 captured
75,000 dead of disease
Total: 340,000 dead, wounded or capture
Bulgaria:
14,000 killed
50,000 wounded
19,000 dead of disease
Greece:
2,360 killed in action
23,502 wounded
1,550 dead of disease
Serbia:
5,000 killed
18,000 wounded
In 2nd Balkan War,
Strength,
Bulgaria 500,221 – 576,878
vs
Serbia 348,000
Romania 330,000
Greece 148,000
Montenegro 12,802
Ottoman 255,000
Total: 1,093,802
Casualties and losses
Bulgaria:
18,000 killed
60,000 wounded
15,000 dead of disease
Total:
93,000 dead or wounded
Serbia:
9,000 killed
36,000 wounded
5,000 dead of disease
Greece:
5,851 killed in action
23,847 wounded in action
580 frostbitten
188 missing in action
Unknown non-combat related casualties
Montenegro:
240 killed
961 wounded
Romania:
negligible combat casualties
6,000 dead of disease
Ottoman Empire:
negligible combat casualties
4,000 dead of disease
Total:
~91,000 dead or wounded
So after all this crap, and after 2nd Balkan war our neigbors start brutal assimilation campaigns n such, what did you expect to happen in retaliation in ww1?
Here’s letters from Greek soldiers from 2nd Balkan war telling how they TOGETHER with Turks pillage n burn Bulgarian villages. http://www.h-net.org/~habsweb/sourcetexts/greeks1…
So, you are still “surprised” that Bulgaria went on a punishment campaign in ww1 which came only a few years after 2nd Balkan war? I’m supposed to care about your relatives after all you did towards Bulgaria? Are you kidding? It was YOU who started all this crap, with Serbo-Bulgarian war, breaking Balkan League by making seperate alliance with Greece, to divide spoils whose result is mostly by Bulgarian effort vs Ottomans.
Terrance&Philip
December 4th, 2010 at 2:00 pm
FTA: "Back in August, German FM Guido Westerwelle told Belgrade that, “The map of southeastern Europe has been laid down and completed.”
Ah, hubris. Arrogance like this can't help but openly invite anger and humiliation. Sure Nemesis is fictional but only a fool believes (and says) that history is finished.
bozh
December 4th, 2010 at 2:59 pm
it is news that hungary wants half of croatia. according to croat'ns, hungary only wante areas north of rive rmura; that's far north of zagreb; it wld have amounted to about, say, 5-10% of croatia.
as for germany 1876, in '19 it had been a much different germany. it was a germany that blamed serbia for being and actor/factor in ww2.
germany, and particularly austria, have been supporting croatia for the same reason; i.e., they thought that all serbia had to do to prevent an invasion of its territory was to allow also austrian agents to be in on watching the terrorist organization, Black Hand.
i an not in favor of expanding hungary or albania. such dispute cannot 'solved' humanely– politicly yes. of course, they need honest helpers!
however, it seems to me that granting minorities an autonomy like s. tyrolians enjoy wld suffice to end this disputes for all time. tnx
bozh
December 4th, 2010 at 3:02 pm
i see i forgot to edit my post. it shld be mura river. i also forgot that hungary wants parets or whole of baranja.
bozh
December 4th, 2010 at 3:30 pm
as far as i know, the Left and the Right heavily approved of serb aggression against croatia. that malic is allowed to contribute to a leftist site like antiwar proves that almost all of the left in US and canada still support serbs.
u.s, u.k., italy, france, and russia actually went to war to defend serb terrorism against nonserbs. today, most of the allies in '14 and '39 have invaded afgh'n even tho they had no proof that even one afghani had hurt one westerner. go figure.
why did nato turn against serbs, say, '94? just to obtain kosovo indirectly? of course, nato had also obtained indirectly croatia also and helped restore fascism there.
nevertheless, nato did not allow croatia to split asunder bosnia. it seems that both ustashe and chetniks have now been forever stopped. i don't think nato wld allow any more warfare to solve
interethnic disputes.
tnx
bozh
December 4th, 2010 at 3:55 pm
actually three croat parliamentarians, including croat leader were assassinated in belgrad parliament and two wounded in '29.
and king alexander then goes on and rewards serbs by imposing royal dictatorship! to serbs, where there were serbs there was serbia.
and yet deny independence to albanians in kosovo even tho it is 90% albanian and all parts of it touching.
serbs, in croatia, to establish small and widely spread enclaves had to murder thousands of croats and expel about 400 k of them.
and have been that stupid to call these separate "serb republic".
babic, president of that republic in '91-'95 blamed milosevic for setting up the republic. milosevic apparently had told him that ustashe were coming to slaughter serbs.
i think he lied!
btw, there were no ustashe prior to '29 or serb terror over croatians since '19. tnx
Vojkan Milosavljevic
December 4th, 2010 at 8:11 pm
I never saw you comment on any other column except those of Mr.Malic. ??? or who do you think you're fooling?
Vojkan Milosavljevic
December 4th, 2010 at 8:16 pm
Conumishu, the dispute between Moldovans and Russians, just as the dispute between the Georgians and Russians, is not a matter of taking sides for Serbs. All three nations are our Orthodox brothers. But sometimes, we have brothers who'd rather side with the devil than sit down with a brother to discuss how to settle a dispute in the best interest of all sides.
Vojkan Milosavljevic
December 4th, 2010 at 8:21 pm
Nis happens to be my hometown. As I have spent most of my life abroad, I never really understood why my fellow citizens detested so much Bulgarians. After reading all your falsehoods, I still have sympathy for Bulgarians because I think that my fellow Serbs aren't completely innocent in our relationship. But I better understand why people in my hometown and in my mother's home village which you occupied during WWII first as allies of the Nazis, then as allies of the Soviets, detest you so much.
Vojkan Milosavljevic
December 4th, 2010 at 8:23 pm
The only pathetic ignorant idiot here is you. Read my answer to your comment above.
Vojkan Milosavljevic
December 4th, 2010 at 8:29 pm
You know, all our neighbours may lurk all they want on our territories, but no Empire has lasted forever and believe me, this time we have learnt that compassion for our enemies doesn't work. The time for retribution always come. Have you heard about Stanislaw Krakow? Well, though born Catholic, he was a Pole, a true Slav, not a mongoloid pseudo-Slav like your breed.
I doubt any Serb will ever again brave enemy lines to bring water to a wounded Bulgarian like in WWI. At least, when our interests clashed, we told it in your face, we didn't stab you in the back, but it's not your fault. Bayazit and Kubilay Khan genes combined couldn't yield no better.
Hrebeljanovic
December 4th, 2010 at 8:43 pm
Again, well said Paleo.
Hrebeljanovic
December 4th, 2010 at 8:49 pm
Pardon me, which part of this:
"You can take your filthy rabid garbage and put it you-know-where. "
you didn't understand?
Vojkan Milosavljevic
December 4th, 2010 at 9:08 pm
And btw, why should Serbia care for a war far away from Serbia? Thank you for making our case before American libertarians.
paleo
December 4th, 2010 at 9:26 pm
Bulgarians were no better to Serbs in the two world wars than Albanians or Hungarians, maybe even worse. Much of that history has been suppressed from the national consciousness because of the supposed "brotherhood" between Serbs and Bulgarians on religious and linguistic bases. However, the Serbs of southeastern Serbia have a very dim view of them, and with good reason. Their religious and cultural similarity to Serbs should all the more argue against such dirty and inhuman behavior when compared to the significant religious and linguistic differences between Serbs and the other two nations I mentioned above.
It's worth noting that Serbia has treated it's Bulgarian minority far, far better than either Greece or Turkey (as this TsarSamuil idiot even points out). Not to mention what Bulgaria did to its Turks in the 1980s (forcing them to change names, flee, etc. all during peacetime). Bulgarians in Serbia can go to school in Bulgarian, street signs are bilingual, etc. In Greece they do not so much as recognize them as an ethnic minority, they are just "Greeks." And the "thanks" Serbs get is irredentism and backstabbery. Which just goes to show that peacetime decency towards ethnolinguistic minorities gets you nothing except more irredentism and rabid nationalism. The same phenomenon happened in Kosovo and we saw where that got us. University of Pristina was the 2nd Albanian-language university in the world (the Albanian language was instituted in 1966, just 20 years after University of Tirana was founded in 1947). They had schools in Albanian, newspapers, signs, etc. All that got Serbia was a rabid nationalist movement that won't die until every Serb in Kosovo flees or is killed and Decani/Gracanica/Pec and all the other monuments of Serbian culture are rubble.
To no avail, the Bulgarian nationalists continue the filthy behavior. Rapid recognition of Kosovo, ATAKA, etc. Read any youtube video comments on music from Serbia's south, even from Kosovo, and you will have some stupid Bulgarians ranting on how Serbs "steal" Bulgarian culture. It's news to me that Ajde jano and Sano duso and Niska banja are "really" Bulgarian songs, but according to them they are. They seem to be laboring under the delusion that any variant of the Serbian language in which noun declension has weakened as compared to Belgrade speech equals Bulgarian by default.
paleo
December 4th, 2010 at 10:18 pm
Why is the Bulgarian government worried about this in 2010?
May 14, 2010
http://www.vesti-online.com/Vesti/Srbija/52937/Bu…
The monument to Serb victims of the Bulgarian occupation of WWI in Surdulica is being rebuilt after 70 years. This has drawn protest from Georgi Dimitrov, the Bulgarian ambassador to Serbia, who wrote a letter to Novica Toncev, the president of the district of Surdulica, in which he expresses "deep concern" about "the existence of real danger of rising ethnic tension because of the construction of the crypt in the schoolyard."
However, Nebojsa Dojcinovic, a member of the organization "Old Surdulica," does not see any problem because, according to his words, the monument-crypt is being rebuilt exactly where it stood before, in the yard of the intermediate technical school "Nikola Tesla" of which he is director.
- The monument-crypt was built in 1924 at that location because in close proximity was a collection camp.
"Surdulica in World War I was the last stop on the road to Bulgaria to which were deported Serb prisoners amongst whom were priests, as well as the most prominent and literate representatives of the people, traders, judges, lawyers, and the elite of the Kingdom of Serbia. All of them, under the guise that they were going to be interned in Bulgaria to work in mines, were taken to Surdulica and murdered there" said Dojcinovic.
Novica Toncev, president of the district of Surdulica, thinks that both sides reacted too quickly.
-Because of the letter by the ambassador I addressed myself to our foreign minister Vuk Jeremic and I am expecting an official reaction, because I as president of the district cannot get involved in international politics.
"My opinion is that both sides should attend the opening and liturgy to the victims and that that gathering should be a sort of reconciliation. I do not see a reason why the representatives of the Bulgarian authorities should not show up at that gathering. Even our president Tadic was in Srebrenica," says Toncev.
Dojcinovic reminds that from 1924 to 1941 ever year on Vidovdan was held a requiem at the monument-crypt. However, after the April war and occupation of Serbia in 1941, occupying forces invaded and demolished the crypt.
"In 1943, the occupiers ordered the students at the civil school, from February 3rd to 17th, brick by brick, to completely demolish the the crypt. The crypt was buried with earth, the bones were scattered here and there. At the time the local people secretly gathered the scattered bones and buried them in the old graveyard of Surdulica," reminds Dojcinovic.
He adds that after World War II, all up until 1989, there was no initiative to rebuild this monument-memorial.
"Only then in 1989 was this project founded in the patriarchate in Belgrade and a committee was founded for the renewal of the momument-memorial. The work was started from the foundations but the war and disintegration of Yugoslavia caused all of this work to cease. As recently as 2004 the "Old Surdulica" organization was founded, which, with the help of donors and certain ministries, renewed in its original appearance the monument-crypt," says Dojcinovic, and adds that it is tragic that many people of Surdulica didn't even know what it was all about.
Translation of the memorial plaque: "At this place in August 1924, a monument-crypt was founded in memory of 20,000 Serbs that the Bulgarian occupiers murdered in the First World War in Surdulica and its environs. Documentation about this crime was destroyed by the Bulgarian fascist occupiers in 1941, whereas the edifice of the crypt was demolished in February 1943. This plaque is placed here in memory of the victims by SUBNOR- district of Surdulica – September 5, 1974."
Aleksandar
December 5th, 2010 at 4:31 am
An interesting Serbian – Bulgarian recount of the game that is history… I wonder why "TsarSamuil" does not mention the MACEDONIANS living in Macedonia ;) Maybe it's because of the 'wherever there are followers of a 'Bulgarian' church, that is a Bulgarian land' mantra. This just proves the point of Mr. Malic and that is the fact that nothing is solved on the Balkans. Nothing. And even if it were solved, there is an inexhaustible supply of hotheads to begin a bloodbath anew and anew ad infinum.
Karl
December 5th, 2010 at 10:47 am
So many keyboard warriorz. But internet warriors are not representative of real people.
bozh
December 5th, 2010 at 11:21 am
correction: i meant to say that germany of '19 blamed serbia as an actor-factor for ww1 and not for ww2.
yugoslavia cld have avoided german and italian invasion of yuga in '41 by simply honoring cvetkovic-macek peace pakt with germany.
royalist serb deposed legitimate govt of yuga in '41 because they were only interested in obtaining a greater serbia.
as i have noted, many serbs opposed break up of yuga. many serbs living in vrbavska banovina joined partizani.
serbs of dalmatia joined royalists. in late '90 dalmatian serbs have joined 'yugoslav' army; i.e., chetniks. tnx
Vojkan Milosavljevic
December 5th, 2010 at 1:35 pm
A decade or so ago, because of sanctions against Serbia, I had to fly to Sofia to reach my home town. When I landed there, I asked if I had to declare the cash I was carrying in order to avoid problems at the border, because I was there only in transit. I was told that since I was a EU citizen, I needed no worry.
At the border between Bulgaria and Serbia, a customs officer went thoroughly through my luggage, making it a mess I had a hard time to pack back, then asked me if I was carrying cash. I answered candidly. What ensued was a typical case of Balkan primitivism looking for a bribe. I held my ground. I have to thank some French patriots for having pushed my appliance for French citizenship. Basically, it was, ok you hold me here, I call my embassy. He let me go, but the argument lasted and was nerve challenging.
I had a similar experience on the Serb-Hungarian border, not because of cash, but because my mother insisted on taking an opened and beginned plum brandy bottle.
I even had a weirder experience in Hungary when I thanked God for having bought a reactive Italian car because I had to race on Budapest's circular to escape road thugs.
In ll cases, before the incident, I had to deal with state employees. Nothing such ever happened to me in Serbia, nothing such ever happened to me in any other European country I've been in.
Before all those incidents, I had been warned by fellow Serbs that the exact same things that eventually happened to me, happened to them.
Wonder then, why we Serbs hold our neighbours, FYROM excluded, in contempt.
We may have a government made of corrupt quislings, but as a whole, we still have some sense for decency.
Vojkan Milosavljevic
December 5th, 2010 at 1:39 pm
It was a few months after NATO bombings, and Sofia looked more bombarded than Belgrade and Nis together.
Vojkan Milosavljevic
December 5th, 2010 at 1:44 pm
Sorry, we have nothing against Romanians either.
Vojkan Milosavljevic
December 5th, 2010 at 1:59 pm
Well said indeed. I admit that of the whores in our neighbourhood, I would only keep Hungarian girls.
Karl
December 5th, 2010 at 2:25 pm
"Wonder then, why we Serbs hold our neighbours, FYROM excluded, in contempt."
I doubt you can speak for a whole nation.
At the end of the day you are just an loudmouth gastarbeiter with a French passport judging whole peoples based on the conduct of one or two customs officers during the few times you visited Serbia. An eternal teenager from the diaspora trying to making up for the lost connection with with own people with chauvinistic generalizations against the neighbouring peoples. You are an outsider and it shines through. Whether where you misspell your own family name, or where you can not but help your western imposed dispositions come out to complain about "typical Balkan primitivism". You can take your ugly hatreds, your western-bred superiority complex and your French passport and shove them.
bozh
December 5th, 2010 at 2:42 pm
it is very telling that serb parliamentarians left sabor [croat'n parliament] after serb army occupied 1/3d of croatia. for, then, in late '90, they were not in any danger and never had been at any time from '45-'91. even that late croatia had been ruled by communist party.
from '90-to ca '93 yugoslavia army was in total control in occupied parts of croatia.
u make own conclusions as to why serb army occupied croatian and began to wage war against croatia mid-91
and as late as early '95, canada had been strongly supportive of the chetniks. croat'n attempt to win back own territory [medak pocket, eg] was severely criticized by u.s and canada.
.
serbian army along with chetniks [extremely hated by ?all croatians] wanted more than the 1/3d of croatia and being stronger than croatian army got in late '91 even hungrier by attacking seaside shibenik in order to reach "yugoslav sea".
however, shibenska brigada defeated mladiches army; which then headed for bosnia, and the serb glory of reaching yugoslav shores vanished forever.
shibenik was predominantly a partizan town and that had been one reason chetniks, who hated even serb partizani, had chosen it as next serb victim.
from this, it follows, that it wasn't ustashe serbs hated as much as anyone else who stood in chetnik's way as the attack on Shibenik, which protected serbs with own blood, clearly proves. tnx
TsarSamuil
December 5th, 2010 at 4:08 pm
Maybe we should also mention the "Thracian nation" and the "Dobrudjan nation" that Stalin wanted to implement?
Vojkan Milosavljevic
December 5th, 2010 at 4:18 pm
It seems I'm not that bad at fishing as I thought. Though, you're small fish.
Well, you're right about FYROM, for Romania or for Hungary, I don't speak for my whole nation. As a matter of fact, I love Brahm's Hungariand Dances, Liszts' rhapsodies, Tokay and Hungarian food in general.
As for the misspelling of my family name, I suspect you found out that I made music. And your reaction shows your sense of inferiority rather than my sense of superiority. Because, you see, I have friends of all ethnicities and of all religions, atheists included.
(continued in the next post)
Vojkan Milosavljevic
December 5th, 2010 at 4:20 pm
Btw, I have spent one third of my life in Serbia, and I'll repeat it, I've learn to read and write at the age of four with the help of a concentration camp veteran.
Do you have problems with the West? From your previous posts, I would have thought that you admired the West, at least when it took on Serbs.
Fyi, while I did my military service as an "occupier" in Slovenia, I slept three weeks under a tent with Albanians, because military hierarchy felt they respected me, because I respected them. Nobody else dared. And when the army got us on a shooting exercise on a Christmas morning in a Vatican bigotry ridden area, my Croat and Slovenian fellows made faces, while I spoke out.
(the end in the next reply)
Vojkan Milosavljevic
December 5th, 2010 at 4:22 pm
(well not the last, still too long)
Fyi, my best friend in the army was a Croat from Sisak, a guy strong as a bull who couldn't hurt a fly. He often finished his comrade's jobs when they got too exhausted. He shared with me some of the best home made hooch I drank in my life.
I know very well the former Yugoslavia, I stripped off high school comrades in poker because I forgot my wallet at home, I suspect they let me win. We then went on to jump over fences to steal freshly ripe pomegranates from Macedonian farmers, and the one that caught me blushed more reddish than me then looked the other way.
I definitely don't regard Kristijan from Istria, Mladen from Sisak, Nebojsa from Dubrovnik or Ermin from Prijedor as inferiors. But I do regard you, the Samuil idiot or 'bozh' as inferior. You are uncultivated, narrow minded and you are ready to approve any verdict on less than partial evidence, just as long as it suits your prejudices.
Vojkan Milosavljevic
December 5th, 2010 at 4:23 pm
(this one is the last)
And as last, fyi, I didn't "misspell" my name in order to suit the "West" but in order to tell them how it is pronounced. But then I worry about substance, and people like you worry about appearances.
Out of curiosity, what's your problem with the French? Because Chirac did one thing right in his whole life by opposing the Iraq war? Because Mitterrand said that while he's president, the French won't attack the Serbs? Because De Gaulle refused to meet Tito because of his Saint-Cyr's mate, Mihajlovic? Because though they have griefs, they haven't been nowhere near as odious with their colonies as have the British? Because they have accepted that they have done wrong things and they have decided that the best way to amend was to welcome the people they otherwise oppressed and provide them with all the welfare they could in order to somehow earn forgiveness?
Open your mind, folk. That's the only kind thing I can say to you.
Aleksandar
December 5th, 2010 at 4:29 pm
I don't know and don't really care what Stalin has told you in private :) The Macedonians exist as a nation, and the Republic of Macedonia is your neighbor. Nice to see how the EU values are upheld by Bulgaria and Greece…
MoT
December 5th, 2010 at 9:12 pm
Hey! He didn't call YOU a bastard, though you deserve to be called one for your idiotic temper tantrum. If there is one thing above all else that defines the Balkan nationalists it is their mindless and bloodthirsty "identity". Think otherwise and your neighbor suddenly goes nuts. For the so-called Christians who pretend to be Gods children I have to ask, "Just what did Jesus tell you to do to your enemies?" If you answer outside of what he told you to do then its high time to stop pretending you're anything but liars to the truth and shame Him with both your words and your actions.
Hrebeljanovic
December 5th, 2010 at 11:11 pm
Hey "TsarSamuil", emperor Basil II(Vasile Bulgaroktonos) asked me to tell you he says hi.
Vojkan Milosavljevic
December 6th, 2010 at 2:51 am
Still, one last thing. I wanted to check before. I know of no Balkan nation where Karl exists as first name. As a matter of fact, it is typically German. So who has a complex here? Unless it's a reference to Karl Marx. Is it?
TsarSamuil
December 6th, 2010 at 3:01 pm
Tell him Krum says hi too! Have some wine, haha!
Vojkan Milosavljevic
December 6th, 2010 at 3:58 pm
To 'bozh', I don't feel like replying to one of his comment in particular, I only went over them in search of assertions that really deserved to be negated.
'bozh', you are not a true believer. If you were, you wouldn't be stretching your ignorance of English so tight in trying to convince people here that you are innocent lambs and that the ustasha's crimes during WWII had their source in Serb sins against Croats.
Which came first '29 or "Srbe na vrbe", in English "Serbs shall hang on willows"?
Do yourself a favour, come true with the crimes your brethren have committed and show contrition for them before God.
Vojkan Milosavljevic
December 6th, 2010 at 4:06 pm
Sorry, I meant 'thin' not 'tight'. My fingers once again spoke fatser than my mind.
BGRezil
December 6th, 2010 at 6:17 pm
Bulgarians should concentrate on cleaning up their own wretched, dirty, corrupt third world country before poking their grubby noses in neighbouring countries affairs. That cretin Siderov from "attaka" is typical of Bulgarian whoredom: In the 1990's he was editor of a NED finnaced pro-NATO rag >Demokracija< that supported jewish Bulgarian foreign minister and albright puppet Nadezhda Mahailova. Nowday Siderov's ATTAKA is a embrassingly anti semititic, after the US funding dried up…
bozh
December 7th, 2010 at 1:24 pm
according serb uzelac, now vice-president of croatia, and other serbs, serbs are returning to croatia; however, the serb pop is not growing because of the fact that the aging serb pop which came back or remained in croatia is dying in numbers to that of the returnees.
many serbs who served as soldiers in serb republic from '90-95 are afraid to return because of secret list of real or suspected war criminals, croatia had compiled.
of course, there are croatians who know killers of own families or family members, and nothing is gonna stop them from killing such people.
expelled croats during serb army occupation also wld take revenge on those people who expelled them.
however, the only reason that croatia allows some serbs to return is because EU demands it. and even if all serbs came back to their homes, croatia wld not ever be in danger from serbia.
as always before, serbia had been stronger militarily; thus, always a great peril to croats. with croatia eventually joining nato [which i am against; provided serbia does not reach a peace pakt with croatia] and with just 4.4% of the pop being serb, croats, et al do not need to fear serbia any longer.
when one of the greatest croatian sons, stjepan radic, had been killed in serb-controled parliament aug. '28, croats had been occupied and w.o. an army.
but they will never again beat us, kill us, put us in prison [like s. radic, macek, croat'n leaders] ever again!
serbs, of course, according to what they knew were correct to do what they did. the problem was that 90%+ of what they knew was false to fact.
mind u, no one cld have expected that france, u.k, among many countries, wld finally stop goading serbs into more paroxicism.
yes, they have been used. in ww1 as well. eg, france was eager to regain alsace-lorraine which prussians won for germany in the 1880s.
u.s apr '17 saw the opportunity to crush germany and its supremacism-imperialism and thus invaded europe but only after germany had been exhausted.
had u.s not invaded europe, the stalemated war on western front wld have remained that way; necessating an entirely different peace treaty; probably occluding ww2 as well.
serb army had been defeated. serbia wld have never obtained vojvodina or kosovo had u.s not invaded europe in '17, thus, tipping balance of power.
and yuga wld have not happened also. u.s also repeats the same tactic in ww2. it invades europe after germany and S.U incurred losses of over 25mn soldiers.
some serbs still haven't learned a thing from any of this. they still demonize or run dwn people which do not agree with them. they are still spewing hatred and calling for more warfare.
more cld be said. tnx
bozh
December 7th, 2010 at 1:56 pm
"srbe na vrbe" was not, as far as i know, a slogan even '41 let alone in '28. it came most likely after mladic attacked sibenik, which had been 90% croat in '90 and now 95% croat.
those serbs which wld not swear an allegiance to croatia were no longer safe; thus, either left or had been expelled.
the above slogan was not an official croatian policy. it has no death penalty. even for serbs who committed crimes against croats.
as already noted, even pavelic had abandoned almost all of dalmatia. one of the reasons for that had been the fact croatians from this region were not quite as pure croatians as n.croatians and and bosnian croats.
we are smwhat darker or even much darker than pure slavs. we are an admixture of roman, illyrian, and slav peoples.
croats were able to croatianize all dalmatian walled towns. but it took centuries and many battles.
tnx
Rad Vuckov
December 7th, 2010 at 5:12 pm
How long you are back from your sanctuary in Argentina? Also, do you remember your Serbian ancestry, when did they convert? I bet not
long ago. You are trying very hard to prove yourself as all converts do.
Now in your last sentence here, it appears that you are also a racist. The
Sibenik countryside is mostly Serbian Orthodox who are invited to defend your kind from the Turks. As last thing, grace to your kind I have most of
my family killed, village by village in west. Slavonia. My own mother was killed and all others perished in your death factories around NDH as Jadovno, Jasenovac and other places. The very last, your
bad conscience (have you one???) make you come here on this site
because there are not many Serbs left in Sibenik. You don't have absolutely nothing to say to anybody except bubbling your ustashes' nonsenses. Read Vojvoda Z. Mishich report to king Aleksandar – why Serbs should not accept Croats in new state and the victors. That was the mistake of heavy consequences for the Serbs. You have a serf mentality to the core and not conscience at all. I believe that your now
religion is not compatible to Slavs in general and German writer Shiller
described you so well in WALLENSTEINS. So, Za dom spremni Bozho!
bozh
December 7th, 2010 at 7:09 pm
one explanation [or u.n claim] of why serbia abandoned croat'n serbs– after initial acceptance of about 100K– was to obtain fresh troops for bosnia. serbs from croatia of fighting age were prevented from immigrating into serbia and had been deployed in bosnia to strengthen the grip on bosnia by serbia and bosnians serbs.
and that's why chetnik leadership issued an order for evacutation of all serbs from srpska rep. krajina on the first day of croat'n for recapture of own territory.
and fact that the siege of city of bihac–largely muslim] from 92-95 by serbs was reinforced by serbs from rsk army soon after serb evacuation from rsk, bolsters the assumption that srbia was interested only in keeping or enlarging bosnian conquest
we know that u.s became alarmed and fearing another srebrenica-like massacre, it permits croat'n army to join dudakoviches [BiH] forces in order to break the siege and disperse serbs.
u.n also reports that serbs of serbia were humiliating and beating srk soldiers for giving up the fight so quickly. it shld be noted that also army BiH participated in the Storm of aug. 5, '95.
croatia had also officially urged serbs not to leave. croatia, from a strategic point of view, had not gained anything from the exodus.
and because of the exodus one k croats had been expelled from vojvodina. in banja luka, expulsion and murder of croats and muslims intensified; most likely because of rsk defeat.
according to some serbs, serbs left rsk because, as they said: nobody was innocent; everybody had done smthing and thus the fleeing.
it shld be noted that much of rsk leadership left the region before croat'n offensive; thus, serbs were no longer compelled to leave. tnx
bozh
December 7th, 2010 at 7:34 pm
my post dealing with u.s invasion of europe is very similar to my letter i sent to canadian, u.k, u.s, french, and german govt in '91.
french, u.k, and canadian govts always acknowledged my letters; germany and u.s never. exception being clinton who personally responded to one of my letters to w.h.
however, the letter he answered was not about ww1 or ww2 but somalia.
and the language i use is that of a houseperson; nevertheless, received no complaint about it.
i do get complaints from meritocratic and supremacistic people. and i am proud of that.
supremacism: ethnic, cultural, linguistic, national, personal i view as the greatest evil that ever befell us.
tnx
bozh
December 7th, 2010 at 7:55 pm
it is very likely that serbs and croats were, say, 3 k yrs ago one pleme [tribe, but not in dysphemistic sense]. that is also true of germans and anglosaxons.
but judging by so many croat surnames n. croatia ending ek, ec, chek and other "ich' less names, they appear more related to czecks.
but once our forefathers accepted the christian cult after arriving in the balkans early 7th c. and it splitting in two ca. 11th c. croats and serbs were bound to become enemies.
same thing happened to celts [also known as gaels, descendants of gauls] of scottish and irish origin.
the fact that both serbs and croats were ruled by 'nobles'; in cahoots with priestly class further exacerbated situation. to me, such people were criminals.
it's usually the poorest and the weakest serbs and croats who suffer the most when supremacists take over governance of the country.
so, the task is to end tyranny of the supremacists. they are still in control in croatia and serbia. tnx
paleo
December 7th, 2010 at 8:34 pm
The likes of bozh and TsarSamuil make me want to leave this forum and never come back. Their level of mendacity is unreal. It's also suffocating because it doesn't deal with facts, or if it does, they are so illogically connected and so blithely spun into a web of lies that it is almost impossible to disentangle the insane and vicious nonsense.
"Srbe na Vrbe" was a phrase dating to WWI and it was coined by Marko Natlacen, an ethnic Slovene. It describes well how Croat/Slovene/Bosnian Muslim criminals performed numerous hangings of Serbs throughout western Serbia and eastern Bosnia during WWI. In WWII, it was engineered to perfection.
We can talk about Ante Starcevic and his proto-Nazi racism some other time.
bozh
December 7th, 2010 at 11:03 pm
i love it when serbs get mad at what i say! they even think i am ustasha! actually, i am an egalitarian! and i don't agree with any inegalitarians, serb, croat, americans, or muslim.
the serbs on this site, i conclude, are either from serbia or bosnia. if from serbia, then, it is obvious, that they are still trying to use both croat'n and bosnian serbs.
however, croatia with just 3 brigades in '90 is not croatia '10 with 70 brigades. nor is muslim bosnia '92 muslim bosnia '10. muslim army is now much stronger and bosniaks still as mad as in '92.
it seems that croatian serbs wld have never ever wanted to turn against their host country if it hadn't been for serbs from serbia. that is my opinion! they wld never have taken, i believe, a military action against croatia unless directed by serbia.
in '90, with yugoslav army officer cadre much serbian, serbia saw the chance to split asunder bosnia. serbia probably thought that it cld not hold parts of croatia forever and wanting to ensure parts of bosnia became part of serbia, wanted croat'n serbs in bosnia also.
but, relying on usual support of u.s, france, u.k; which had not come in '95 or even today, all serb efforts came to naught! tnx
Tomislav
December 8th, 2010 at 3:26 am
Bozh is no Croatian nationalist, nor patriot, but he sounds like some sleazy Yugoslavist.
bozh
December 8th, 2010 at 8:48 am
tomislav does not see bozidar quite right. i do deem and call clergy "mafia". and i am not supremacistic in any way; includes in an ethnic manner.
it is true that i did not want see break up of yugoslavia. for one thing, sibenik lost 1k youths in fighting for it. and not just that town only, but all cities and towns along crot'n littoral massively rose against italian occupation.
it had been chetniks, in the main, which broke up tito's yuga. c'mon, neither croats nor serbs anything special; most of them appear for cosa mias. most of them r deluded. nearly all stole anything they cld and with not a bit of shame or care-respect for another.
btw, croats have no national church like serbs. serb clergy totally independent. croats have always had pope as head of their church and croat clergy answered to vatican.
so serb assertion that we were catholized orthodox appears as fabrication.
the question to ask, wld be what have serbs gained by solving the problems apoliticly? what have sons of ustashe gained in bosnia.
croat'ns constituted about 18% of bosnian pop. now it is less than that! and the main causes being overly ethnocentric, jingoistic, loaded with false to fact knowledge, led by criminal clergy, and mafia. tnx
bozh
December 8th, 2010 at 11:34 am
ok! serbs and croats: there had not ever been an entity called "truth". so, stop hunting for the snark.
but there is truth 1 [serb], truth 2 [croat], truth 3 [magyar] and so on.
in addition, say, truth 3 1500 is not truth 3 today.
however, the way out of the linguistic trap [yes, folks, that's all it is] wld be to accept an apodictic truth; i.e., necessary or absolutely certain truth that peace in the balkans was always available to us and is available now.
similarly, of absolute certain or desirable truth croats and serbs cld obtain a structure of society in which everybody wld earn equal pay for equal needs.
this simplicity cannot be further defined [explained]. it wld, of course, be complexified. it is a wont of clerics and 'educators' [saves saying socalled] to simplify complexities and complexify simplicities.
so, that ?all serbs and croats 'understand' everything and understandings valid for all time! isn't that neat?
i like that one. i 'understand' or 'know' everything??!! so don't u try, damn it, to confoose me, please!
the above notions rest on another. as far as i know i am the only one propagating it on many dissident sites.
once again looking apodicticly, i assert that we are ok and not avaricious, murderous, violent, unruly, stupid, etc. as the 'noble' class and clergy tell us.
the problem arose, as had been intent by ancient and modern 'nobles', that our ancestors actually evaluated blatant lies and hate speeches by the greatest criminal minds as true.
too bad that our ancestors have not beheaded the first shaman, sorcerer, wizard, priest that showed up. however, it is not to late to send the clerico-noble class back where they came from: to hell.
else no peace on earth!
Tomislav
December 8th, 2010 at 12:43 pm
You are high on some drugs, Božo?
bozh
December 8th, 2010 at 3:05 pm
tomislav,
i awaited just such a reaction. i also expect that santa claus wld visit every shanty, sleeping bag, doorway, asylum, tent, refugee camp, war zone, bedlam, and mall.
and people wld cast away their dependence and cosa mias and opt for cosa nostra or interdependence as rich people have done.
do u think rich americans are not interdependent and strongly united just for that while we are strongly for cosa mias; i.e., each person for herhimself?
which means, they are lying to one another; cheating-robbing one another. my devil, we are so disunited, 12 funni uncles cld rule with iron fist– and do– mns of us.
yes, yes, people in u.s like it that way, but only because they had been conditioned-taughtti like pavlov's dog had been taught to salivate at mere sound of bell.
americans get proud and teary at mere sight of flag; so how's that differ from how a conditioned dog behaves.
but pavlov was a descent fella; so, he deconditioned the dog to salivate only at sight of food.
actually pavlov's discovery is one of the greatest discoveries ever made and very much applicable to humans.
do u think i get teary at seeing croatian flag or emblem? do u think clerico-noble class of lowlife wld ever stop conditioning children to become meat for their warfare and to behave as serfs?
fat chance, huh? also spricht bozhidarevski. tnx
Vojkan Milosavljevic
December 8th, 2010 at 7:23 pm
Bez zezanja, they really dare pretend that 'ajde jano' and 'niska banja' are their things. Well, i'm acquainted with a polish piano teacher who thinks otherwise. And he played those things in a Paris luxury hotel, "Le Bristol", for one groom and his mom. He knew the origin of those things.
Tomislav
December 9th, 2010 at 5:39 am
LOL. The usual Serb victimistic paranoid narrative. Serbs are eternal "innocent victims" of all of their neighbouring peoples: Croats, Hungarians, Bosnian Muslims, Albanians, Bulgarians, Montenegrin separatists (did I leave someone out?) Then, of course, great forces, of past and present, like Turkey, Germany, USA, France, Great Britain (the last three "betrayed" the poor Serbies, who were their allies in tow world wars, booooh hoooh, how sad). And there is also Vatican, of course. Right-wing Serbies also mention Komintern and Communism etc. Eternal snivelling about victimhood, massacres, (alleged) genocides, graphic tales fo (mostly invented) gruesome acts committed against Serbies and similar. Makes me think sometimes that Serbiandom (srpstvo) is rather a psychiatric diagnosis than a term denoting belonging to some nation.
conumishu
December 9th, 2010 at 11:21 am
Of course, taking sides is purely optional. National interests involve ultimately bilateral issues and often issues are fueled by the way history was written. There are instances though when one side is "more" right than the other, if I may say so. Certainly, a compromise can bring a lasting solution, but it must be a weighed one. Unfortunately, most often than not, "third parties" want to bring their "wisdom" (not to mention their clout) into the dispute and, by accident no doubt, the issues never get settled satisfactory. In the case of Rep. of Moldova the conditions would be almost perfect for a no-tears, no-losers, no future resentment solution. Would be a pity if it doesn't happen.
By the way, the Russian speaking minority in Rep. of Moldova really bothers the EUcrats. They'd love to blackmail Romania like they are doing with the Hungarian and even German minority, but they are clearly viewing Russia as a threat (no matter some in EUrope believe differently) and so they are stuck. But this is a truly complicated topic.
eric siverson
December 9th, 2010 at 6:16 pm
I have the feeling that all Serbia has to do is call on Russia if they want assistance . Russia has said they would like to help Serbia , But Russia doesnt feel they can honestly be more Serb than the Srebs are . It is absolutely amazing that Serbia hasn't asked Russia for help ., but sooner or latter that will be the only choice left for Serbia . Or there will be no Serbia . If Russia comes to help the Serbs realgn the new nazi nato borders , no one will try to stop them .
Hrebeljanovic
December 9th, 2010 at 7:53 pm
I did, he says: "Yup, you are the krums from Tatars." Have a glass of milk, ho-ho-ho!
Bianca
December 9th, 2010 at 9:34 pm
You folks are depressing. No wonder empires found Balkans a fertile territory. With so much local grievances, it is the easiest thing on earth to exploit! Why do not you see what is being lost in all this insistence on being right by defining reality the way it suits us.
Instead, look at what Balkans has lost. This is the territory of the autochtonous indoeuropean language root, the remnant of the remnants of what was the culture around the former sweet water lake, where Black Sea is today. While the traces still remain in Anatolia in its Kurdish population, many other liguistic traces have disappeared, save for the Balkans. Even with the heavy Slavic influx in western parts, and the influence of romanization and influx of Bulgars, the underlying layer of indoeuropean culture, both linguistic and other anthropological data, points to fundamentals that bind the region of Serbia, Romania, Bulgaria and Macedonia, as well as Montenegro and Bosnia to the west. Instead of focusing on science, you allow pettiness to trash the heretage of the region into oblivion. Grow up.
BGrezil
December 11th, 2010 at 6:40 pm
Hey TsarMendil …Who wants to be in dirty poor, yet expensive Bulgaria in run down dirt holes like dragoman or pernik.?..All the kublai khans children from Dimitrovgrad all have a BG passport and let few go and live in a dirty soviet era bloc in Sofia's Nadezhda district for 100 leva and work in a chalga bar or on trakiya magistrala pod mosta kraj rund ….Selling cigarettes to the gladni ot sofija is much more profitable….
bozh
December 11th, 2010 at 7:32 pm
a few days after saying that serbia abandoned serbs of croatia, i heard on u-tube what leading croatian serbs had to say about that. they all confirmed what i said. sekulic, vojinovic, novakovic, et al revealed that they knew croatia wld attack them at 05:00 and on the 5th of aug. 95.
they said that french, canadians, americans, et al told them of the attack and suggested they get in touch with belgrad for advice to capitulate or not.
belgrad could not be reached.
a day before, peter galbraith, u.s ambassador to croatia, knowing of croatian offensive, persuaded babic, president of rsk, to accept croatian ultimatum. galbraith then informed tudjman and sharinich, the defense minister, of babiches decision.
tudjman accepted it but sharinich did not and told galbraithj that there are 10 "struja" [currents] among croatian serbs and not just one; thus, accepting one does not mean the other nine wld go along babiches.
and attack was launched. serbs of croatia also accuse chetniks from serbia of running away as soon as croatia attacked.
escapees to serbia and bosnia were ridiculed, beaten, condemned by other serbs for not standing up to croats.
sharinich also stated that tudjman was afraid to launch an attack. he feared serb invasion. however, sharinich said to tudjman that he wld give his right arm if milosevich wld attack croatia.
he also had an impression that tudjman and milosevic understood one another perfectly; often calling each other by first name.
so, it does seem, that serbia had been interested only for serb bosnia; which by that time needed fresh people and fighters!
i am now learning that another war may break out in bosnia because its govt is much ineffectual. if it comes to war serbs are bound to lose yet another war. west is against dismemberment of bosnia.
muslims are still thirsting for revenge and not only because srebrenica massacre of at least 7,144 muslim males, but also for other massacres and expulsion from srebrenica; which was 75% muslim in '95.
devil help anyone once u.s turns against him. and serbia most likely wld lose parts of bosnia and vojvodina. time for serbs to face stark reality.
btw, not all serbs agree with chetniks [fascists] tnx
bozh
December 12th, 2010 at 1:54 pm
in feb '95 knin serbs offered croatian govt a deal: serbs wld have own money, flag, president, laws, etc.,
croatian minister of defense, sarinic, was told by serbs that they did not want to talk with him about their plan, plan b 4, but with tudjman.
sarinic replied that what serbs wanted in that plan was a state of their own. serb answer was that they did not know what exactly was in it.
but u wrote the whole thing; so, how come u don't know what it contains? said sarinic. naturally, they never got a chance to talk to tudjman.
it is interesting that serbs of croatia have accused chetniks from serbia of running away when croatian army attacked 'serb republic'; while serbs from bosnia and serbia accused croatian serbs of not fighting hard enough against croats.
it is true that serb 21st corpus from kordun had surrendered to general stipetic. about 5k soldiers were taken prisoners on that occasion. however, under agreement, they cld stay or leave for bosnia.
they choose to leave. i am still trying to find out if any of these people are returning to croatia.
stipetic accepted the deal with the commanders of 21st only because he felt he was saving croatian lives.
hunters of '91-95 period are now being hunted. and muslims keep singing: never forget or forgive.
this means that no part of bosnia wld ever be serb. and with possibility of serbia losing also vojvodina and sandzak, serbia may also abandon bosnian serbs. tnx
TsarSamuil
December 12th, 2010 at 1:55 pm
You don't know much what you are talking about, all Balkans are in economic problems, Serbia is worse off, so why should you who are in worse conditions be trying to make your neighbor (that is better off) look worse than you? To make yourself feel better? How sad.
You do not know the great people of Dragoman, also that's where we crushed you Serbs after you backstabbed Bulgaria, invaded Bulgaria by starting Serbo-Bulgarian war. So I suppose that's why you don't like it. Reminds you of the great asskicking you got when u faced us 1 on 1, after that you didn't dare fight without allies, why else did u go to Greece for help to make alliance with them against Bulgaria, don't dare stand on your own? Hah!
Now, go n live in your delusion that we Aryan Slavs are yellow Mongols, lol, n that Serbia is Beverly Hills n Bulgaria is Detroit. Whatever fantasy makes you feel better, cuz you must live a sad life to want to cover your eyes so bad with falsehoods.
This is the President of Bulgaria http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgi_Parvanov
This is the President of Mongolia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsakhiagiin_Elbegdor…
It's quite sad, for all to see how much complexes Serbs must have against Bulgaria to sit there n imagene we are entirely different race than the one we are :)
As for our economy today, it would have been better if not for the bad infrastructure of our neighbors n those who fought in western Balkans cutting off Bulgaria from outside markets. Romania almost no bridges to Bulgaria, one is being built right now. Greece had few crossings to Bulgaria, being afraid of Bulgarians cuz they don't admit they have non-Greek minorities in Greece. But now with bad Greek economy they are changing their views. Then there was Albania who had..stuff that couldn't exactly be called roads. The Turks were not much help either. And lastly western Balkans warzone, cut off Bulgaria too, n bridges over danube (Serbian-Romanian etc.) were bombed by NATO, leaving over half of the Bulgarian commercial fleet on the wrong side of the sunk bridges, unable to sail back home.
Bulgaria's economy would have been a lot better if we still had a seaport to the Aegean like we used to n not be dependent on our neighbors conditions n situations. If Bulgaria had endless coastlines like Greece, Bulgaria would have been much better off. But current situation is a passing era, we may not have neighbors like Czech Rep neighboring rich western countries but with furure better infrastructure throughout the Balkans, Bulgaria's economy will blossom once again. Btw China is very interested in Bulgaria right now,
Bulgarian Transport Minister: China's High-Speed Rail Invitation 'Real' http://www.novinite.com/view_news.php?id=121817
Chinese Businessmen: Bulgaria Most Important Balkan State. http://www.novinite.com/view_news.php?id=121007
Also, we are building Belene, our 2nd nuclear plant, so we will have lots of energy, so don't worry about Bulgaria's future staying where it is, we are only going forward!
All u Serb pig farmers are taught since birth to be jealous of the funding fathers of Slavic orthodox society, church, culture, identity. Remember we are oldest state in Europe, first Slavic orthodox church, Tsar, University, developed n spread Slavic culture n literature for centuries when Serbs lived in our shadows, learning from Bulgarians. You hate us because you know how deeply influenced n connected you are to Bulgaria, you hate that you aren't responsible for it all (development of Slavic society). All you Serbs have complexes :) Your Dushan was half Bulgarian, his wife was Bulgarian, Serbia then got it's first Patriarch by the help of Bulgaria, you adopted Bulgarian style for centuries before you had a proper church, or how many centuries after Bulgaria had it's first Tsar did you have one of your "own" (half-Bulgarian^^)?
Always remember little Serb, Tsar Simeon, that glorious name, the first Tsar, will haunt you forever, jealous wretched little creature! :)
TsarSamuil
December 12th, 2010 at 2:31 pm
Bulgaria created the Cyrillic Aphabet under Boris and Saint Clement. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clement_of_Ohrid
Saint Clement of Ohrid (Old Church Slavonic: Климє́нтъ Охрїдьскъ, Bulgarian: Свети Климент Охридски [sveˈti ˈkliment ˈoxridski]; ca. 840 – 916) was a medieval Bulgarian scholar and writer and a pan-Slavic Saint. He was the most prominent disciple of Saint Cyril and Saint Methodius and is often linked to the invention of the Glagolic and Cyrillic alphabets. He was the founder of the Ohrid Literary School and is considered as a patron of education and language by most Slavic nations. He is regarded to be the first Bulgarian bishop.
Tsar Simeon, world's first Tsar is the figure all Slavic leaders throughout history looked upon. Took Russia 5 centuries to get their own Tsar, before that Sviatoslav, Kiev Rus tried to make Preslav, Bulgarian capital, capital of Kiev Rus, because they knew Bulgaria was the heart of Slavdom's development (in it's early stages). http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1…
Look upon this painting, http://www.pricejb.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/slav-epic…
Title: The Bulgarian Tsar Simeon – The Morning Star of Slavonic Literature.
From the Slav Epic, http://www.pricejb.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/slav-epic…
After Slavic Tribes migrated around in the medieval ages, it was Bulgaria, first of all that set the standards for Slavdom. Just because they don't teach you the basics of early Slavic history in Serbia and you only focus on yourselves, doesn't mean what happened, didn't happen. I know, you are very ignorant n angry people, but that's how it is with people with complexes. So tell me, what did Serbs give Slavdom compared to what Bulgaria did?
Don't say Slivovitza, that was created in Troyan Monastery, Bulgaria. ;)
So, why do I bring up all these history lessons for all to see? Well, to see how stupid Serbs are when they want to make Bulgaria seem like Mongolia, so Serbs can feel better.
TsarSamuil
December 12th, 2010 at 2:34 pm
Slav Epic, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Slav_Epic
Eric Siverson
December 13th, 2010 at 6:37 pm
no kenny was on another website he even said something I agreed with once .
BGrezil
December 14th, 2010 at 9:06 pm
Yet nowdays all country is known for is whoredom, "ciganija" chalga, kurvi and decay..US bootlicking and dirt poor like a central american banana republic in the 1980's
Georgi Purvanov – a second rate BKP selanin turned US ar@ewipe..
Look at all other BG leaders; Bce rezil
Borrisov – total simple backward selanin ex -Zhivkov bodyguard
Stanishev -ukrainian import failed social democrate
SimionSaxe -ageing and poor geman princling a Rothchild patsy and couldn't even speak Bulgarian properly..
Ivan Kostov -Dunav Vlach and CIA puppet
Stefan Sofianski (acting) total scumbag
Zhan Videnov -bizarre "socialist" in the mid 1990's apparently close to moscow nowdays a teacher…removed by the CIA and BG mafia with hyperinflation
Renatta Indzheva – arrogant and useless BKP founctionaire..
BGrezil
December 14th, 2010 at 9:18 pm
Pavel Chernev BG mongol and mafiot
http://www.novinite.com/view_news.php?id=68970
Mongols http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=12…
spot the difference