Setting the Trap
Levin-McCain bill would create a presidential dictatorship. Where is the outrage?
Buried in the annual defense appropriations bill is a provision that would give the President the power to use the military to intern anyone – including American citizens – indefinitely, and hold them without charges or trial, anywhere in the world, including on American soil. The provision essentially repeals the longstanding Posse Comitatus Act, which prevents the military from engaging in law enforcement on US territory – the greatest fear of the Founders. Approved by a Senate subcommittee in secret hearings, the provisions open the road to a military dictatorship in this country – and for that we can thank Senators Carl Levin and John McCain, who introduced the measure. Both the FBI and the Pentagon came out against the Levin-McCain monstrosity, and Senator Mark Udall (D-Colorado) introduced an amendment striking the provision: the amendment was defeated in the Senate, 37-61.
The mind reels. As the ACLU’s Chris Anders puts it:
“I know it sounds incredible. New powers to use the military worldwide, even within the United States? Hasn’t anyone told the Senate that Osama bin Laden is dead, that the president is pulling all of the combat troops out of Iraq and trying to figure out how to get combat troops out of Afghanistan too? And American citizens and people picked up on American or Canadian or British streets being sent to military prisons indefinitely without even being charged with a crime. Really? Does anyone think this is a good idea? And why now?”
Why now, indeed – and the answer is not hard to fathom. With the US banking system making very loud creaking noises as the eurozone descends into the economic abyss, and a total meltdown staring us in the face, the Powers That Be want to make sure they have their hands on the reins of power – and on the whip they won’t hesitate to use.
Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.) exults that the bill will “basically say in law for the first time that the homeland is part of the battlefield” and anyone can be imprisoned without charge or trial “American citizen or not.” Graham doesn’t care about any of that sissy constitutional stuff, and never did – throw ‘em in the brig! Sen. Kelly Ayotte, a Republican from the “Live Free or Die” state, doesn’t care that she’s destroying the American republic and our constitutional liberties by voting for this draconian measure because, she says, “America is part of the battlefield.”
Nothing illustrates the longstanding warning from antiwar advocates that “war is the health of the state” than this ominous development. The principle that war leads inevitably to the erosion and eventual destruction of our constitutional form of government is being dramatized on the floor of Congress even as I write these words. At the Republican foreign policy debate held recently, Professor Gingrich lectured us on “the difference between national security requirements and criminal law requirements,” and, drawing on this spurious distinction, averred:
“All of us will be in danger for the rest of our lives. This is not going to end in the short run. And we need to be prepared to protect ourselves from those who, if they could, would not just kill us individually, but would take out entire cities.”
For the rest of our lives we’ll be in thrall to Gingrich, Graham, Levin, and the rest of them, on the pretext that we’re about to be nuked by a bunch of marginal fanatics hiding in a cave somewhere. It’s a thin rationale indeed for setting the stage for martial law in the United States, but it couldn’t have come at a more convenient time for our rulers, as they face the prospect of civil disorder in the face of economic collapse.
That the authoritarian strain in American politics is coming to the fore in this time of crisis should come as no surprise. Backed up against a wall, the ruling elite is baring its teeth, and the Constitution – which has long been a mere piece of moldering parchment rather than the law of the land – is easily disposed of. Our cowardly Congress, which lives only to advance special interests and line its own pockets, is hardly a bulwark against this onslaught: indeed, they are the source of it.
So where are the Tea Partiers, who warn against “Big Government” and denounce “RINOs” like Sen. Graham who don’t share their aversion to centralized authority? They’re busy campaigning for Gingrich, the “true conservative” and $1.6 million Fannie Mae “consultant,” who preaches the virtues of endless war. Besides, the Levin-McCain provisions will only be used against them damned Mooslims – right?
Wrong – but by the time these “patriots” realize how wrong they are, it’ll be too late. As Rep. Justin Amash, one of the few congressmen elected on the Tea Party wave who has a conscience (and a brain), put it, this bill, which is “carefully crafted to mislead the public,” is one of the most “anti-liberty pieces of legislation in our lifetime.”
As the economy collapses – say, around next week sometime – and as people line up at the banks to get their money out, and discover the till is empty, as the food distribution system breaks down, and the mobs gather and swell, they’ll call the army out into the streets to keep order. And it will all be perfectly “legal.”
Don’t tell me our sainted solons are cringing in fear of al-Qaeda, which is by now a mere shadow of a shadow: the real object of their fear is the American people – and they have every reason to be afraid.
The “debate” in Congress over the Levin-McCain provisions is not really what it appears to be, as Marcy Wheeler points out in some depth. On the Senate floor, opponents of the provision, such as Dianne Feinstein, mentioned the dangers of the army patrolling the streets of American cities only in passing, if at all: their real objection is that the provisions impede the really existing “war on terrorism.” Wheeler argues that the Obama administration would be constrained from utilizing its network of informants if detainees were handled by the military. As she puts it:
“Again, I suspect that’s the Administration objection. It allows them to do these things. But requires they do them with a paper trail Congress can audit. In short, it’s a future Fast and Furious scandal, the guaranteed exposure of all of their harebrained undercover operations, waiting to happen.”
The administration’s veto threat has nothing to do with protecting civil liberties: indeed, quite the opposite. As Sen. Levin noted in his remarks, a bit of politicking went on at the secret Senate hearing:
“The initial bill reported by the committee included language expressly precluding ‘the detention of citizens or lawful resident aliens of the United States on the basis of conduct taking place within the United States, except to the extent permitted by the Constitution of the United States.’ The Administration asked that this language be removed from the bill.”
The real purpose of the Levin-McCain provisions is entirely unrelated to “terrorism,” either by al-Qaeda or any known domestic outfit. It was put in there to codify a number of important “legal” precedents, which make it possible for the President to declare an American citizen an “enemy combatant” and hold him or her indefinitely without charges. This is the final step in a process that will enable the President to establish a de facto military dictatorship: it’s the “unitary presidency” meets the global economic crisis.
“America is part of the battlefield,” says Sen. Ayotte, quite accurately – and Americans are the target. Resistance is “terrorism”: dissent is a crime, and you’d better shut up and take it if you know what’s good for you. That’s the message they’re sending – and how, one wonders, will Americans respond?
Tryptophaned into a submissive lethargy by large doses of turkey and stuffing, and living in constant fear of imminent destitution, they hardly notice this historic betrayal. The trap is set, baited, and ready to spring: one has to wonder, however, if this passivity will hold once those steel jaws bite. I bet they’re wondering in Washington, too.
NOTES IN THE MARGIN
We are headed straight for a military dictatorship in this country – but it isn’t too late to fight back. Antiwar.com is in the front lines of the battle, educating the American people about the nature of the regime we live under and making the case for liberty and peace. Yet we can’t do it alone: we need your help to keep up the fight. The success of our winter fundraising drive is essential to our survival, so please give today – because the future of the country depends on it.
Read more by Justin Raimondo
- Up Against the FBI – May 23rd, 2013
- Antiwar.com vs. the FBI – May 21st, 2013
- Two Cheers for ‘Isolationism’ – May 19th, 2013
- Our Civil Liberties, RIP – May 16th, 2013
- Raping the World – May 14th, 2013





MvGuy
November 29th, 2011 at 10:20 pm
I wonder how long after this bill passes before the disappearances of citizens begins to occur…… Legislation that usurps the constitution ought to at least require a two thirds majority to pass….. This is trouble for all involved! The perpetrators of this bill are committing TREASON….!!!
RickR30
November 29th, 2011 at 10:29 pm
Just when you think things can't get any worse. Spread democracy around the world, install a tyranny at home. Since those zombies of MadMcCain and Levin the leach have probably not written a single word on paper in decades and are unable to turn on a computer, one has to wonder, who really provided these two offspring of harlots with this repugnant provision?
So the homeland is the battlefield now… And here I thought we were "over there" so we wouldn't have battles here. I guess that just turned out to be a giant lie- marketing for the war. Now that our freedoms are coming officially to an end for Americans, will "they" still hate us?
Here's a solution for what troubles the bastards in DC: have the military round up Americans and put them in all those private jails they've been building everywhere. From there, what used to be known as the CIA and Blackwater will take over manhandling the inmates. And it seems they are expecting a lot of business.
Whom will they target? Occupiers, tax evaders, Antiwar.com donors, DVD pirates, CD rip uploaders, smokers, whisteblowers, and most importantly- gun owners.
We've lost our country. What are Americans to do other than emigrate and let neocons and foreigners keep this land. After all, there are still some countries left where Americans are appreciated and that treat them better than America does.
Jamess
November 29th, 2011 at 10:41 pm
Fortunately I have already preempted that by living overseas now. It used to be that America stood for something, democracy, freedom, etc. We could hold ourselves up as an example. Now, in the name of "security" the US has lost its constitutional moorings in a slow erosion of rights since 9/11. All that's left is to declare a state of emergency and suspend elections. Not that elections matter anymore.
I remember a few years before 9/11 watching the movie The Siege with Denzel and Bruce Willis, I thought at the time it was a silly premise, that erosion of rights would never happen in the US. Now it seems prophetic. America as we know it is dead and gone, flee if you can, it will only get worse.
Nelson_2008
November 29th, 2011 at 10:42 pm
Whenever I thought I'd finally seen the bottom, they'd show me a new depth of depravity. Now I realize there is no bottom…their wickedness, their treasonous criminal treachery knows no finite bounds.
Let's face it, they either have to abandon their plans for world rule, or they have to wax ever more oppressive – they have to escalate. And we know they can never back off and change course, since they've already committed so many monstrous crimes. Thus they can never afford to let Ron Paul or any other reasonable or semi-reasonable person anywhere near the reins of power. They can never allow an investigation into 9/11 or anything else for that matter…they're riding a tiger and they can never dismount.
skulz fontaine
November 29th, 2011 at 10:51 pm
Me thinks there's a fight brewing. About damn time. Feed them shotguns kids…
MvGuy
November 29th, 2011 at 10:52 pm
I remember thinking, they will need to win EVERY battle….Soon comes the devalued money battle… The battle no empire ever wins…!!
T.J.
November 29th, 2011 at 11:48 pm
They just want to KEEP US SAFE! The terrorists are everywhere! They're hiding behind every rock, every tree, every…bush. They're everywhere just waiting to strike, I tell ya! There's that one in Texas who couldn't find his keys! And that other one who couldn't find a place to live or tie his shoes! But he had a drill! Need to ban drill bits! The terrorists are everywhere! They're everywhere! They're gonna get us!!!
Am I SAFE? Are you SAFE? KEEP US SAFE! Are we SAFE yet? This bill will surely KEEP US SAFE.
sandyfeet
November 30th, 2011 at 12:02 am
From Wikipedia
:he Stanford prison experiment was a study of the psychological effects of becoming a prisoner or prison guard. The experiment was conducted from August 14th-20th, 1971, by a team of researchers led by psychology professor Philip Zimbardo at Stanford University.[1] It was funded by a grant from the US Office of Naval Research[2] and was of interest to both the US Navy and Marine Corps in order to determine the causes of conflict between military guards and prisoners.
Twelve students were selected out of 75 to play the prisoners and live in a mock prison in the basement of the Stanford psychology building. Another twelve of the same 75 were selected to play the Guards. Roles were assigned randomly to the 24 men. The participants adapted to their roles well beyond what even Zimbardo himself expected, leading the "officers" to display authoritarian measures and ultimately to subject some of the prisoners to torture. In turn, many of the prisoners developed passive attitudes and accepted physical abuse, and, at the request of the guards, readily inflicted punishment on other prisoners who attempted to stop it. The experiment even affected Zimbardo himself, who, in his capacity as "Prison Superintendent", lost sight of his role as psychologist and permitted the abuse to continue as though it were a real prison. Five of the prisoners were upset enough by the process to quit the experiment early, and the entire experiment was abruptly stopped after only six days. The experimental process and the results remain controversial. The entire experiment was filmed, with excerpts made publicly available."
There is no bottom, there was another experiment done much earlier someone on Ron Pauls site made mention of it I just can't remember. One group torturing the other, and no matter how much they screamed the tortures just kept going except for one who quit. Luckily it was an experiment and those who were screaming were only paid actors.
Maidhc Ó Cathail
November 30th, 2011 at 12:24 am
In a November 2010 WRMEA report, Carl Levin was the No.1 career recipient of pro-Israel PAC funds with $728,737. By contrast, buying John McCain’s loyalty (to Israel) has been a bargain at a paltry $207,000.
MoT
November 30th, 2011 at 12:31 am
I find it interesting that only one quit. That says a lot about how willing people are to commit horrific acts and still pawn off responsibility because "someone told me so".
MoT
November 30th, 2011 at 12:33 am
That's been my plan for years but unemployment and the matters of life got in the way. Still, that's my ultimate goal.
Adolf
November 30th, 2011 at 12:35 am
Its 1938 again, but this time in the U.S.A.
mickperry
November 30th, 2011 at 3:14 am
The Milgram experiment: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XpIzju84v24
Oswaldwasalefty
November 30th, 2011 at 3:39 am
“America is part of the battlefield”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AdDLhPwpp4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNHXuf6qJas&fe…
All hail Augustus Obama!
George
November 30th, 2011 at 4:44 am
Don't forget it would have been Augustus W if he'd had his way. He tried.
O'Raiffeartaigh
November 30th, 2011 at 7:13 am
Well, the threat of another terrorist attack on American soil is real. The first thing that should be done is to implement a National Origins Immigration Policy -instead of the Native Born White American destroying act of 1965-that competely excludes Muslims. If a National Origins Immigration Policy had been passed that among other things completely excluded Muslims, 9/11 would have had 0 probability of occuring…this would have decreased significantly the probability of Iraq War two and the Afghan-Pakistan war. The Republican-Democratic treasonous policy of race-replacing the Native Born White American Majority with high fertility post-1965 nonwhites is the single most important causal factor in the explanatory framework for the current situation of the encroaching police state and imperialist foreign policy…it makes it all possible with high probability.
MvGuy
November 30th, 2011 at 7:25 am
Could this brutality be an unforced error by the "O" crew…??? Wouldn't our "O" be better off to let the demonstrations flourish and play "Poor Beleaguered ME" to the voters……. All the head cracking is apt to depress the turnout of his base… Because the people who don't support him: [E.G. "@NoPastNoFate Stop being a dickhead you liberal mouthpiece. It's about putting an end to your left wing nonsense. Go crawl back in your tent."] ain't going to vote for him no matter WHAT candidate the Repugs run.. WTF… Sometimes it seems that "they" want to beat us into submission…. even when it is of questionable political utility…. Bleak…Bleak…Very Bleak..!!!
Nelson_2008
November 30th, 2011 at 7:44 am
Note to the NYC District Atty. and the NY State Atty. General:
Even if you don't see it (or pretend to not see it), there are signs that the Russians and Chinese are starting to see it. I am of course referring to the criminal insanity of our Masters and their obvious genocidal/suicidal gamble for complete world domination and control.
I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I feel I have a moral and civic duty to inform you that the Russians are building – or have already built – a massive bomb shelter under Moscow. What do the Russians know that you don't know, Mr. District Atty.?
Please allow me to tell you: They know that the "people" you're protecting are leading the world to a nuclear cataclysm. They know that the "people" you're protecting are not only criminally insane and evil beyond words, but have also painted themselves into a corner. That's what they know and you don't.
You may have temporarily ingratiated yourself to your political overlords by not doing your duty to investigate 9/11, but that won't stop the nuclear missiles coming your way. I don't know which U.S. cities will be hit, but I know your city, NY City, will be one of them.
I wonder, will you be sitting in your office when that fateful day finally arrives? Or will you be at home, getting vaporized together with your family? When the day finally comes when our Masters push too far, and the missiles fly, and you have 20 minutes to live, what will your final thoughts be? Will it have all been worth it?
sherban
November 30th, 2011 at 8:30 am
It is very strange that after ten years of successful wars made conform Bush doctrine "we fight them over there such we don't need to fight them over here" ,so after such success "we need to fight them over here".
Generalissimo X
November 30th, 2011 at 8:53 am
where is the outrage indeed? genocide in iraq, daily murders in the afpak region, a gov't by the bankers for the bankers who have looted the people to amounts in the trillions. 10 years of complete fear mongering insanity and nothing even close to truth regarding 9-11. the mere fact that gitmo exists and provokes no outrage from our population or elected officials is in itself an abomination of the highest magnitude. and now they are trying to declare us all terrorists whenever they want with no discretion. pure evil. i've seen this coming for a long time now, but i'm a "conspiracy theorist" lunatic. sure i am. we have a war monger in chief and 5 or 6 other complete imbeciles vying to take his place. war, death, destruction and ruin are the daily background noise of our existence and the best we can muster is sitting in a park "occupying" nothing. if anyone reading this has a sliver of hope that anything will change apart from a violent revolution they are a better person than me.
O'Raiffeartaigh
November 30th, 2011 at 9:30 am
Nelson and genarlissimo are of course pushing the 9/11 truther nuttines
O'Raiffeartaigh
November 30th, 2011 at 9:36 am
Here is how you protect Native Born White Americans from another terrorist attack:1)0 Muslim legal immigration;2)deport all Muslims out of America for they are a completely unnatural presence in Our America and 2)stop invading and attacking Muslim societies. All of this could have been done in 1965.
Generalissimo X
November 30th, 2011 at 9:37 am
yeah and your insane race baiting is right on target?? give me a break. you rant about muslims and non-whites, and despite all your insipid social psycho babble you're just a glorified racist. the threat of another terrorist attack is real? really, i guess that's why there haven't been any in 10 years. moron.
Nelson_2008
November 30th, 2011 at 9:55 am
Sorry chumpy but the only "nuttines" [sic] here is yours.
Generalissimo X
November 30th, 2011 at 10:16 am
i'm probably wasting my time talking to someone with such a bizarre world view, but time is one thing i have in spades. how would the deportation of all muslims, something that is insane to even suggest, let alone to implement, keep us white americans safe when our own white congress is literally attempting to destroy due process of law? seriously, this is the one of the hallmarks of western civilization and is the very foundation of our american society. this article and what's transpiring in a legal sense has nothing to do with muslims. moreover, the destruction of the rule of law in this country and subsequent corruption has done more damage to our republic than 10,000 9-11s. who needs terrorists when our country has descended into a military police state?
Steve
November 30th, 2011 at 10:21 am
Wrong, Adolf. It's 1917 again and the direct ethnic descendents of those Bolsheviks who according to the despicable Winston Churchill's description: '….seized the Russian people by the hair of their heads'….have been working like a team of ravenous termites every since their false flag attack on 9-11 to resurrect their beloved USSR right here in North America. Remember: One of the very first 'laws' that was passed when the Bolsheviks took over Russia was to make 'anti-Semitism' a capital offence. Criticizing the Bolshevik government was equivalent to being charged with this new crime, and they took you out and shot you – if you were lucky. If you weren't lucky, they sent your butt off to Siberia where they worked you to death in the slave labor camps. This template is not hard to predict, because the same one these evil people used in Russia is being followed pretty closely right here in America.
You and everyone else need to understand that the constant Hollywood demonization of Germany and of those long-dead Nazis is merely a tactic to distract your attention away from the real threat to freedom and liberty. Hint: It ain't Nazis.
O'Raiffeartaigh
November 30th, 2011 at 10:47 am
Well of course to someone such as yourself who is an enthusiast for demographically replacing Native Born White American Christians with high fertility Muslim legal immigrants and their Muslim "American geneline street by street,town by town,county by county and state by state by state it must seem "bizarre". In your anti-Native Born White American worldview any White American who does not comply with your demand to commit demographic suicide is a racist.
Muslim immigration-in addition to its very serious demographic threat-is most definitely associated with an increase in another terrorist, it will be used as an excuse to nuke Iran. Alex Jones and his nutty truther brigade has been exposed as frauds and liars..they are also race-replacement enthusiasts traitors.
O'Raiffeartaigh
November 30th, 2011 at 10:49 am
previous comment intended for truthers nelson and generalissimo
MetaCynic
November 30th, 2011 at 11:16 am
There is a sliver of silver in this storm cloud. Since this bill allows the military to seize and indefinitely detain anyone deemed to be a threat to the United States, what's to prevent an organized group of patriots in the military who take their oath seriously to seize and dismantle the federal government and then do nothing. It might be easier than it sounds.
Everyone who is anyone attends the president's annual State of the Union address. This means that the entire federal leadership, the top politicians, bureaucrats, judges, central bankers and military personnel as well as private sector VIPs will be conveniently gathered together in one room to celebrate their boot on our necks. Since the federal government is by far the greatest threat to America, it is now lawful for anyone in the military to arrest the federal leadership and detain it indefinitely.
True, the visible federal government takes its orders from the real rulers – the bankers. But the transmission belt will be broken and the bankers will have no one left to bail them out. The power vacuum can be filled by the 50 states as they see fit.
NadePaulKuciGravMcKi
November 30th, 2011 at 11:17 am
1984 …
Knockin' on your door
Will you let it come
Will you let it run
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKHSf1PDYfE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIzITqBcRnY
MoT
November 30th, 2011 at 11:29 am
No doubt. They are two peas from the same pod.
red
November 30th, 2011 at 11:34 am
"The war party thirsts for conflict as the [adult male red deer] thirsts for water." Bismarck
MetaCynic
November 30th, 2011 at 11:46 am
O'Raiffeartaigh:
If Muslim Americans are such a security threat, then why have they been so silent during the ten years since 9/11? There are 9 million Muslims living in America. If only 1% of them are filled with suicidal hatred toward us, that means that 90,000 Muslims living among us are willing to give up their lives in order to hurt us. That would average out to 24 suicidal terrorist attacks on American soil per day since 9/11. Yet nothing has happened.
Vast conspiracies are not required to wreak havoc. Motivated lunatics acting alone can do lots of damage. Guns, explosives and all kinds of tools for mayhem are readily available here. Yet nothing has happened. No bridges have been blown, nor trains derailed, nor malls filled with noxious fumes, nor guns emptied at sporting events. Absolutely nothing has happened other than potential terrorist attacks funded and orchestrated by the FBI.
For those with eyes to see, this phony war on terrorism is in reality a war on the American people and our liberty.
Richard
November 30th, 2011 at 12:06 pm
I hate to even jump in here, but 'they' (muslims living here) may be the first to be forced to action. They will be the first group openly attacked or rounded up and imprisoned en masse.
So, (I'm just sayin'…) Maybe the racists will join the administration and its minions in attacking ANYBODY who shows a love or commitment to freedom.
But really, some of you guys are taking too much prescription medication (O'Raiffeartaigh).
Generalissimo hits it square on the head. Standing up means putting it on the line and not making excuses or hiding. It's natural to hide or lay down and beg for mercy if you consider yourself prey.
Nothing else needs to be said about the cowards who want to blame people with dark hair or funny accents for their own failures (like allowing this country to be taken by sleazy thieving bastards and traitors).
Personally, I don't' care where someone gets his genes. As if anybody actually understands what makes a man a man – bullshit. The proof of a man's value to his brothers is determined 100% by what makes him stand up and what makes him shrink away.
do ya think it matters who stands up? If it's not in you, peddle your bullshit somewhere else.
I do apologize for being impolite.
ftsdc
November 30th, 2011 at 12:13 pm
the milgram experiment. both were conducted to explain the atrocities of nazi germany.
Ike Hall
November 30th, 2011 at 12:50 pm
Well, there's the rub, isn't it. It's going to have to get a lot worse before your average Joe Sixpack or Jane Boxwine realizes what's really going on, if then. A violent revolution will fail, mark my words. That's a coup d'etat, not a revolution. A true revolution will consist of nothing more than people finally saying "no".
Jon
November 30th, 2011 at 1:25 pm
Could this be why "NorthCom" had been set up in the US? Reported somewhere was that military personnel were being pulled from all over the globe, and being assigned to NorthCom.
Wilson
November 30th, 2011 at 1:30 pm
So, now we know the joint answer from both the Repubs and Dems to the Occupy protests. They obviously want to throw all protesters into a camp somewhere.
Will people please stop voting for these dangerous fools. We could have a whole new Congress and a new President who all recognize and protect American rights and liberties. We could have it as soon as 2012. The key is that we have to stop voting for Dems and Repubs like they are the only choices. They want us to believe they are the only choices so they can then agree with each other that we have no rights and only exist to pay the bills for their rip-offs. But, we don't have to vote for Dems or Repubs. Please learn not to do so.
BTW, don't blame me, I voted for McKinney, a Green for Senate, and a Libertarian for Representative last time. How I wish right now that others had joined me in casting similar votes. Anyone from any alternative party like that would be much, much better than these power-mad fools who obviously only view us as their slaves.
Gerald
November 30th, 2011 at 1:33 pm
From the last ten years, we know the people who want to hurt us are idiots who try to light their underpants on fire. And people dumb enough to fall for FBI entrapment scams.
Remember, the CIA has set off more Terror Bombs within Iran than we've seen in the US since 9-11.
Walter
November 30th, 2011 at 1:39 pm
You have to always have hope. To quote an old football coach, the only time you are surely beaten is when you give up. Try to remember what Ghandi said about how every tyrannical system has always collapsed. None last very long. Its not like the Romans are still around nailing dissenters to a cross in a 2000 year old Roman Empire.
I'm not terribly in favor of how the Occupy movement's tactics have shifted in the last month or so, but maybe if instead of being dismissive and critical of people who are actually doing something for change if you went out and supported them, things might have a chance of getting better.
Mr. Hall is right. From the Soviet Union to Egypt, the true revolution comes from the people coming together and simply saying No. And, the lesson from both of those places is that it happens suddenly, and that none of the experts see it coming. It could happen tomorrow. Maybe you might be the one to start it by standing up and just saying No. Why not try it and see what happens?
Lucy
November 30th, 2011 at 1:46 pm
Well, when we finally do return America to being the land of the free, we'll have to remember that we shouldn't let back in the cowards who fled and ran.
If no one is willing to fight for freedom, then we won't be free. The problem with America today is that too many want freedom without fighting for it. They instead run away. No doubt they'll want to come back once we do regain our freedom. But, those of us who stayed and fought should remember that the heart of the problem was that for too long too many people weren't willing to fight for freedom. And hopefully we'll be smart enough to realize that if we let back in those who ran away, we are just recreating that original problem by once again building a citizenry who just expects freedom to be handed to them on a silver platter and who run away the first time they realize that this isn't happening.
There are already protests in every major American city. How about going and joining them instead of running away?
MetaCynic
November 30th, 2011 at 1:52 pm
It's not clear if this bill has become law with the Senate approval or if the House must now ratify it. If the House has already ratified it, why haven't we heard about the military detainment provision earlier? If that provision was added by the Senate, then must the bill be reconciled between the two? Would that then mean that it's still possible to have the offending provision removed?
Martin
November 30th, 2011 at 1:53 pm
I guess you are still mad that George Wallace and his fellow racists lost the election?
If this country had always enforced a policy of supporting only "Native Born White Americans" and worked to exclude all others, then none of us would be here today. The thing about America is that you come from one of three basic groups. Native American Indians. People who immigrated to America. And Slaves who were brought here against their will.
I'm willing to acknowledge that at one point in the 19th century, that my ancestors were non-native born white Americans who immigrated to this land. Your racism and bigotry would have slammed the door in their face. And strangely enough, unless you are almost certainly saying you'd have denied your own ancestors entry to America. After all, you are descended from either a non-white heritage as an American Indian or former slave, or you are descended from non native-born immigrants. You have some very strange ideas.
RollCall
November 30th, 2011 at 1:57 pm
Here's a list of anti-American traitors … Do not vote for any of these people for any reason.
NAYs —60
Alexander (R-TN)
Ayotte (R-NH)
Barrasso (R-WY)
Blunt (R-MO)
Boozman (R-AR)
Brown (R-MA)
Burr (R-NC)
Casey (D-PA)
Chambliss (R-GA)
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Coburn (R-OK)
Cochran (R-MS)
Collins (R-ME)
Conrad (D-ND)
Corker (R-TN)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Crapo (R-ID)
DeMint (R-SC)
Enzi (R-WY)
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Grassley (R-IA)
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Heller (R-NV)
Hoeven (R-ND)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Inouye (D-HI)
Isakson (R-GA)
Johanns (R-NE)
Johnson (R-WI)
Kohl (D-WI)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Lee (R-UT)
Levin (D-MI)
Lieberman (ID-CT)
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Manchin (D-WV)
McCain (R-AZ)
McCaskill (D-MO)
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Nelson (D-NE)
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Risch (R-ID)
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Thune (R-SD)
Toomey (R-PA)
Vitter (R-LA)
Whitehouse (D-RI)
Wicker (R-MS)
Anonymous
November 30th, 2011 at 2:01 pm
[...] [...]
Jack
November 30th, 2011 at 2:04 pm
Like all appropriation bills, this originated in the House. So, it passed in some form their earlier. It most likely does face some sort of reconciliation process with the Senate version, as it seems unlikely that it passed completely unchanged. However, the committees that do the reconciliation bill are always stacked with insiders and rebels who oppose such provisions are never on those committees. So, it would take a rebellion in either the House or the Senate of refusing to pass the bill that comes out of that reconciliation committee. I think I did see that Obama was threatening to veto this, but that would shock me if it really happened. Obama says a lot of things, then rarely does anything. And he has a long track record of approving of provisions just like this. After all, its Obama who claims for himself the Executive Power to simply order the assassination of any American any time he chooses. Thus, my bet would be that Obama would most likely announce a 'compromise' where this remains largely unchanged and then he'll sign it. Obama never says not to the military, so I can't see him both saying no to these new powers the military wants and I can't imagine him saying no to yet another bloated military budget.
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d111:H.R….
H.R.5136
Latest Title: National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2011
Sponsor: Rep Skelton, Ike [MO-4] (by request) (introduced 4/26/2010) Cosponsors (1)
Related Bills: H.RES.1404, H.RES.1467, H.R.5013, H.R.6523, S.3454
Latest Major Action: 6/28/2010 Received in the Senate. Read twice. Placed on Senate Legislative Calendar under General Orders. Calendar No. 447.
JLS
November 30th, 2011 at 2:37 pm
Me too! As soon as I can scape up enough money, I'm out of here.
ML3
November 30th, 2011 at 2:51 pm
Neat! A handy list for all and sundry.
Where do we begin?
Redeagle1
November 30th, 2011 at 3:02 pm
Did they strike Section 1032- that expressly stated the exemption of American citizens? If so, can you provide links to the current proposed Bill? (What is available on line still has Section 1032.)
Mick
November 30th, 2011 at 3:26 pm
I usually agree with you but you are wrong. We need to repeal the 1965 act alright.but there is no need to pick out Muslims specifically. ALL immigration needs to stop. There needs to be a constitutional amendment not allowing ANY immigration to this country ever again. With a real unemployment rate odpf over 20% only insanity could explain legal immigration at 150,000 a month while our citizens dive into poverty. Of course, all illegal immigrants should be deported in total. We ave enough people at 300 million plus. The same people pushing these wars are for open borders. How may of you know Obama has stopped deporting all illegals unless they have committed a serious crime. He basically saying there is no such thing as an American. all we need is a million plus people to descend on the capital and they will start to get the message. Sound impossible. Not with the new social media being used by hundreds of millions of people in the U.S.I believe things are going to go the antiwar way, if we do not start a nuclear war first,
Mick
November 30th, 2011 at 3:30 pm
Insane racism? If it is insane then every country on earth are insane racists.Where are the other people willing to flood their.country in a matter of decades with Third World hordes. I have traveled to 170+ countries. The world you exist in, does not exist in the real world.
San Fernando Curt
November 30th, 2011 at 3:31 pm
As sad as it is to admit, the only surprise here is the measure's defeat. With imprimatur from left and right, professional POW and sanctified liberal, what's not to like? Interesting such a drastic suspension of our national soul would come now. Do they know something we don't? Maybe that economic meltdown II isn't far off, and they'll need extra precedent muscle to keep us in line.
Mick
November 30th, 2011 at 3:37 pm
Everything those Southern Apartheid groups predicted would happen. Has happened. They unfortunately knew more than us Northern arrogant Whites. There is more racial hatred in America now than ever. And it is growing. Blacks versus Mexicans, Koreans, Whites, Jews. Muslims against Jews. Northeast Asians against Filipinos and Malay racial groups. It goes on and on. Pre 1965 America was a model in harmony compared to now.Whole Southern and Northern Black run cities resemble some bankrupt Third World hellhole, than the most advanced civilization in human history. Which was America Pre 1965.
Nelson_2008
November 30th, 2011 at 5:33 pm
The "protests" are primarily about dissatisfaction with the economy, are they not? Let's face it, the vast majority of "Americans" apparently don't have any problem whatsoever with our Judeo-fascist dictatorship, the "war on terror", the loss of their constitutional rights, and the wholesale slaughter and subjugation of millions of people on the other side of the world who never attacked or threatened the U.S. in any way. Moreover, "Americans" continue to join the Army, they continue to work at Lockheed-Martin, Boeing, etc., making drones and hellfire missiles and bombs and what have you. The flag-waving blowhards even continue to vote for corrupt establishment candidates.
Put simply, the "U.S. government" is corrupt because the majority of the people in "America" are corrupt. Morally incompetent people don't get good government. They can never be "free". They're simply not capable of it.
Fighting for "freedom" in "America" today means fighting a civil war against the corrupt majority who despise "freedom". What's the point? Why not leave and let the majority have the nuclear war they demand.
Generalissimo X
November 30th, 2011 at 6:13 pm
native born white people? this is valid to you? get over yourself. to answer your question, most of western europe comes to mind. i'm certainly not thrilled by illegal immigration of any sort, but at the same time to actually think deporting all muslims is rational or even possible is ridiculous. no country engages in such a policy and i've traveled plenty there mr. high and mighty. its imbecilic thinking like yours that lead to japanese concentration camps in america. as a random aside you might want to look at the constitution and the part about freedom of religion before you condemn an entire religion in one broad brush. very sophisticated thinking.
Jon
November 30th, 2011 at 7:35 pm
Here is how you protect Native Born White Americans from another terrorist attack :
stop messing in other country affair, stop invading them, stop economically bullying them.
simple isn't it ?
psh
November 30th, 2011 at 7:55 pm
Excellent response! Thank you.
psh
November 30th, 2011 at 8:08 pm
And, the sad thing is scum like O'Raiffeartaigh does even know how evil they really are.
psh
November 30th, 2011 at 8:10 pm
"stop invading and attacking Muslim societies"
Finally, something I can agree with. Please do that. But not going to happen, because your establishment is just as evil as you.
Denise
November 30th, 2011 at 8:12 pm
At least Obama will veto it, right?
James
November 30th, 2011 at 10:20 pm
I'm not coming back. Historically once governments gain power they rarely relinquish it back to the people unless by force of arms. The American people are too slothingly and cowardly to fight for their rights back. Look how the Patriot Act is still in place.
The current protests are self-centered, demanding more action from the government, instead of a roll back of government power. Elections are a sham, unless a signifcant third party arises, the War Party will be elected 100% of the time. Even if this bill is struck down it won't matter, they will try again and again.
Oh how's flying these days? I fly internationally in comfort now, no taking off my shoes, no pat downs, no body scanners, customs and immigration is a breeze anywhere I go. The only place I have ever been hasseled by immigration inspectors is, yup you guessed it…America.
JLS
November 30th, 2011 at 10:56 pm
Great response Nelson!
montaigne
December 1st, 2011 at 6:21 am
Oh, I just learned from the radio, that Hillary Clinton has landed on official visit to some foreign country and demanded THEY release THEIR political prisoners. What morals! What courage! Truly American heroism and superiority!
Generalissimo X
December 1st, 2011 at 8:50 am
good stuff curt, especially "national soul". if i didn't know better, i'd think you're suggesting that some may be "conspiring" against us. hmmm…
Eric Albert Schwing
December 1st, 2011 at 9:18 am
The shock troops of the middle layers have come to the fore, as they did in Nazi Germany. Whole sections of the middle class will divide between social forces opposed to class and empire tyranny, and those who are the defenders of fascist tyranny. This of course means a possible civil war unless we arrest every congressman for treason who voted for Fascism, police state laws, and prosecute these proto fascists in the same way we prosecuted German capitalist fascists.
Why now?? I suspect that many liberal Zionists, pro Israeli, class politicians are also gearing up for war with Iran, and putting on their Gestapo boots by enabling this totalitarianism, when the world moves against these Western fascists, Nato fascists, and Israeli war criminals. They are moving towards a global fascist Matrix, these elites in all class states, embracing fascist austerity, war and fascism, while the masses are moving away from all class politicians.
Time for a wholesale rejection of all class parties, class politicians, if we want to smash the Global fascist Matrix, its Western fascist appparatchiks, and shock troops for Fascist Capitalism and the push for War by fascist Zionists, and their corrupt enabling liberals.
JLS
December 1st, 2011 at 10:52 am
Totally agree! I've got no desire to ever set foot back inside America.
O'Raiffeartaigh
December 1st, 2011 at 2:38 pm
psh
I consider you to be the racist scum. You harbor malignant intent towards millions of Native Born White Americans. And this malignant intent is embodied in post-1965 Immigration Policy. So why are you shocked that Native Born White American resistance is growing towards the hatefull policy of race-replacement? What do you intend to do when White resistance is full-blown open.
Shut all muslim immigration down to 0 and stop attackiing muslim nations. The demographic shift so desired by leftists such as Noam Chomsky is a terrorist attack on Native Born White Americans…a much greater scale of violence against the Native Born White American Majority than Mohammad Atta and the Blind Shiek could ever dream of.
San Fernando Curt
December 1st, 2011 at 3:50 pm
…But not with holograms.
Mike
December 1st, 2011 at 4:15 pm
Are you, by any chance, actually suggesting that Churchill was some sort of flag- holder for freedom? If so, you need to study some history.
Also, the ideology of Bolshevism and Nazism is really quite similar.
Unabashed, centralized, government power is anathema to freedom, Steve. One needs no religio-ethnic conspiracy to understand this-those with power are damned dangerous, no matter what they call themselves. Including, perhaps especially, Churchill.
Mike
December 1st, 2011 at 4:21 pm
Last I checked, it is "native born White American Christians" who run the budding police state, hold herd on the military industrial complex, and are the vast, VAST, majority in Congress.
Perhaps they are the problem?
You are nauseating.
Howard T. Lewis III
December 1st, 2011 at 9:49 pm
Two things: 1) The reason we got nowhere in exposing witnesses to the loading of a demolition apparatus into the WTCs is the fact that EVERY website i have consulted has blown off actual installers since day-1. 2) As long as the DHS and TSA are NOT going to say out loud who did 9-11, they are nothing more than gay ruffians abusing your junk at gunpoint, and making entertainment of it in videos for the Bush cabal.
O'Raiffeartaigh
December 2nd, 2011 at 6:13 am
Mike
You can always adress the specific points in my comments. You are a race-replacement enthusiast. So here is the queston:Why should millions of Native Born White Americans be in favor of looding their country with hostile Muslims?
liberranter
December 2nd, 2011 at 1:16 pm
The real question, one that I've yet to gauge an accurate answer to, is just how many active duty, reserve, and retired military personnel remember, heed, and are willing to act on their oaths of enlistment and commissioning to "uphold and defend the Constitution of the United States, against all enemies, foreign and domestic. Having served for nearly two decades in the imperial legions myself (though nearly a decade and a half removed), I'm tempted to say that the percentage willing to defend true freedom is greater than most of us think. The real question, I believe is: At what point will the majority realize that treason has been committed by the powers that be, and that obeying that one specific order to finally tear up the Constitution and drive a fatal stake through the decrepit heart of the Republic will spell the death of Ameri[k]a as even a pretense of a "free" society? Will it be when troops are ordered to implement martial law? When USNORTHCOM orders troops to overthrow state and local governments and begin seizing and detaining American citizens indefinitely?
There's probably no way of knowing what will serve as the proverbial "straw that breaks the camel's back," but for my own part, I make it a habit to ask every uniformed member of the armed services or "law enforcement" with whom I engage in conversation what their position is. So far, all have at least paid lip service to liberty and the rule of law and swear mightily that they'd NEVER obey a clearly unlawful order. What they'll actually do when TSHTF is, however, another thing altogether. All we can do is be ready.
liberranter
December 2nd, 2011 at 1:20 pm
Will people please stop voting, PERIOD? It's a sham and a farce, does nothing but entrench power-hungry psychopaths in high office, and changes nothing for the betterment of liberty. Stop lending the process legitimacy!
liberranter
December 2nd, 2011 at 1:22 pm
In other words, damned near the entire Senate. Treasonous traitors, every last goddamned one of them.
liberranter
December 2nd, 2011 at 1:24 pm
Oh, and did I mention – f*** you, John Kyl and John McCain, disgraceful specimens of subhuman excrement that typify the majority here in the Grand Scamyon State.
liberranter
December 2nd, 2011 at 1:25 pm
There's a truly special place in hell awaiting that disgraceful bitch.
Nelson_2008
December 2nd, 2011 at 6:53 pm
He called Churchill "despicable", so he apparently sees Churchill for the filthy scum bag he was. If anything Nazism was a reaction to Bolshevism (and Jewish supremacist political mania), wasn't it?
Mr. Mcguckin
December 3rd, 2011 at 8:06 am
Howard T Lewis
The muslim legal immigrants knocked down the Twin Towers..it is no more complicated than that. The 9/11 truthers are retards.
Mr.McGuckin
December 3rd, 2011 at 8:21 am
Mike
You are referring to a small fraction of a percentage of the Native Born White American Christian population that sold its sold for $$$$ to Israel and the Military Industrial Complex
Muslim legal immigrants flew a passenger jet into the Twin Towers on 9/11..They almost knocked down the Twin Towers on nov 7 1993..if the 1965 Immigration Reform Act had not been passed and if Muslims were completely excluded form America..9/11 does not occur…Therefore, the excuse for the police state is greatly diminished.
I understand your logic:no muslim terrorist attacks since 9/11…therefore…full-speed ahead withmuslim immigration and the race-replacement of the Native Born White American Majority.
Native Born White American Christians ar under no obligation to commit demographic suicide because it would make you and the multimillionaire Noam Chomsky very happy.
Free Ema West!!!!
The antiwar movment harbors openly malignant intentions towards the Native Born White American Christian Majority..no wonder the antiwar movement is a joke..think about it Justin…
Mr. McGuckin
December 3rd, 2011 at 8:30 am
Jon
9/11 and the earlier attack on the TT in Nov 1993 would never have occured if the 1965 Immigration Reform Act had never been passed and if there had been a national origins immigtion policy that completely excluded muslims. Obviouosly this would have been a wonderfull thing..unless you are a treaonous racist race-replacement enthusiast such as the multimillionaire-and the intellectually way over-rated Noam Chomsky.
The race-replacement enthusiasts are using 9/11 as an excuse to justify race-replacement of the Native Born White American Christian Majority…they shouldn't be shocked that the antiwar movement is percieved as treasonous fifth column.
Free Emma West!!!!!
Mr.McGuckin
December 3rd, 2011 at 8:39 am
Martin
You are the one with the very strange and bizarre postion on imimgration. Zenophobia is a healthy and very normal thing. If and when Native Born White American Christians become a racial minority within the borders of "America" I have absolutely no doubt doubt that you and the multimillionaire leftist Noam Chomsky will enthusiastic support the zenophobia of hindus,sihks,muslims,africans,homng,asians and hispanics that excludes European immigrants form "America's " shores and reduces the current Native Born White American Majority to a violently persecuted racial majority.
The Ameridians migrated to America..moreovever the curernt thnking among scholars in this field is that it is now an open question as to who came to America first..thre is eveidence for an earlier Eurpean migration.
Free Emma West!!!!!
Free Emma West
Mr Mcguckin
December 3rd, 2011 at 8:46 am
metacynic
You mean 9/11 and the earlier atack wasn't bad enough? Why do you and multimillionaire leftist Noam Chomsky believe that Native Born White Americans should have taken the risk in the first place? There were-and still are-no economic,demographic an ecologiocal reasons fr impoprting even one muslim..never was. To prempt your response:Native Born White American Christians are under obligation to commit racial suicide within the borders of America because the Muslim "Americans demand it.
Free Emma West!!!
Oathkeeper
December 3rd, 2011 at 9:02 am
To all you spineless, limpwristed cowards who have or want to turn your yellow backs and leave the country I say, GOOD RIDDANCE, the rest of us don`t need or want punks like you here. War is an ugly thing but, not the ugliest of things, the degraded state of moral and patriotic feelings which thinks that nothing is worth fighting for is much worse. A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing he cares about more than his own personal safety, is a miserable, pathetic creature who has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the sacrifice and exertions of better men than himself.
Generalissimo X
December 3rd, 2011 at 9:31 am
the nov 93 "attack" wouldn't have occurred if the fbi hadn't given their patsy a real bomb to plant.
Patrick Henry
December 3rd, 2011 at 9:56 am
Section 1032 does NOT exempt American citizens, it simply makes the detainment of American citizens DISCRETIONARY, not REQUIRED. The wording is extremely devious and is designed to mislead you to think the detainment does not apply to U.S. citizens when actually it is the "requirement to detain" that does not apply. The military is not required to detain U.S. citizens but rather it is left to their discretion. This is the exact wording from section 1032 (b) of S.1867 that the Senate passed:
APPLICABILITY TO UNITED STATES CITIZENS AND LAWFUL RESIDENT ALIENS.—
(1) UNITED STATES CITIZENS.—The requirement to detain a person in military custody under
this section does not extend to citizens of the United States.
See, the wording does not explicitly state "citizens of the United States cannot be detained under any provisions of this bill" but instead says the "requirement to detain" does not extend to U.S. citizens. So they're not required to detain you but they still can.
MetaCynic
December 3rd, 2011 at 12:47 pm
Mr. Mcguckin:
What, in your opinion, should be done with native born white Americans who convert to Islam? Expel them to somewhere? Maybe place them in concentration camps? Muslims have been living peacefully in America for centuries. I would think that the tenets of Islam have remained pretty much consistent over those centuries. Why were Muslim Americans not a problem 200 years ago but are now regarded by some as such a threat to our collective security that the Bill of Rights must be suspended to keep us 'safe' from them?
During the 19th century there was extreme hostility in America by native born whites toward Irish Catholic immigrants. In your opinion, do Irish Catholic Americans now qualify as native born whites, or are they cultural aliens who should all be deported to Ireland? The census of 1900 classified Italians and Slavs as non-white. Are these two groups in your opinion still non-white? If so what should be done with them?
How do you arrive at your notion that only certain races should be allowed to inhabit a geographic area? Only first comers? In that case everyone without American Indian blood does not belong here.
As for 9/11, anyone who spends some time objectively studying and deconstructing the events surrounding that day cannot but come to the conclusion that, if Muslims played any role at all, it was orchestrated by native born white Americans.
MetaCynic
December 3rd, 2011 at 1:11 pm
Mick:
There were boom and bust cycles followed by heavy unemployment when the population was a third of what it is now. Yet the economy recovered, jobs were created, the economy grew and immigration continued. Immigration creates jobs. Immigrants have the same human needs and consumer demands which must be satisfied as do non-immigrants. They pay for all these job creating goods and services with money they make working to produce something of value.
Unemployment is a result, not of immigration, but of taxes and regulations punishing job creating risk taking by entrepreneurs as well as the boom and bust cycles caused by central bank credit creation (counterfeiting). Immigrants can be lured to America by welfare. That is a reason to get rid of welfare not immigration.
If all immigrants were expelled, unemployment would still remain high because the immigrants' consumer demand would disappear along with them. But the real culprits, taxes, regulations and inflation would remain unaddressed.
MetaCynic
December 3rd, 2011 at 1:50 pm
liberranter,
You raise a good point. History is replete with soldiers obeying orders to abuse and even kill civilian fellow countrymen. Though, off hand, I can't think of an instance in modern times where a nation with a centuries long history and tradition of freedom such as the U.S. have, suddenly fell under a military dictatorship. A long tradition may in this respect be a powerful ally.
A real deterrent to martial law can also be the 2nd Amendment. Will the military want to tangle with scores of millions of armed civilians especially if many of them are former soldiers with combat experience? Would they carry out unlawful orders affecting their relatives, friends and neighbors?
The fact that Ron Paul is receiving more in donations from active military people than all other candidates combined including Obama indicates that his libertarian message is well received in the military. Maybe the military as an institution takes its oath to the Constitution much more seriously than does our psychopathic civilian government eager to use the military to silence criticism.
Sam
December 3rd, 2011 at 5:20 pm
Former Arapaho Sheriff Patrick Sullivan – an extremely well-connected member of the Colorado political elite – has been arrested in a meth-for-sex scandal allegedly involving underage partners of both genders. The american GULAG is real and the hypocrisy beyond belief.
MoT
December 3rd, 2011 at 6:54 pm
Ah, you always knew in your heart that the McCainiac would swing this way. That's disgusting enough. Kyl was another when you consider his past comments. My two Senatorial Swine have likewise backstabbed me and all the other peasants of our state. Damn them both to hell.
j_in_mesa
December 3rd, 2011 at 7:41 pm
Well, this spineless, limpwristed Marine (0311) is planning on getting out. Perhaps brave patriotic 'Oathkeepers' like yourself will be there at the border to stop me from leaving. I shot Expert in Pistol and Rifle with additional CQB training, so we'll see if you show up at the Nogales crossing. I'm sure you know what I'm talking about … being an 'Oathkeeper' and all.
Jaime
December 4th, 2011 at 10:54 am
Are you still with that same retarded view about whites and their precious genetic DNA that has to be saved?
Jaime
December 4th, 2011 at 10:58 am
Seriously, I think Martians came first. By the way, isn't your other name O'Raiffeartaigh?
MetaCynic
December 4th, 2011 at 2:18 pm
Scientists have detected Nano thermite, a high tech explosive, in WTC dust. Their findings have been published in a peer reviewed journal. Are you suggesting that "Muslim legal immigrants" are also responsible for planting explosives at the WTC? Why would they go to all the difficulty of highjacking planes if they were able to plant explosives? Or maybe the plane crashes were just spectacular theater, and the real demolition was carried out by explosives planted by someone else?
The FBI doesn't think that Osama bin Laden had anything to do with 9/11. An FBI spokesman said so publicly. Its most wanted page mentions nothing about bin Laden being wanted for 9/11. http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/topten/ He was wanted for attacks on U.S. embassies in Africa. No mention at all of the attacks on 9/11. Why? That's like a biography of Babe Ruth failing to mention his home run records!
Flick
December 5th, 2011 at 7:39 am
j_in_mesa, just curious, what was that oath you took when you joined the USMC? I take it you consider it to no longer be in effect for you. I was never in, but I plan on staying and fighting. As I see it — and I've considered living in another country — moving abroad only delays the unpleasantness. Once the U.S. goes, there's nothing to stop the globalists from enslaving the entire planet. I just think we stand a much better chance of grinding down leviathan here than from anywhere else.
Carl
December 6th, 2011 at 9:03 pm
You will be amazed at the number of guns that come out of the closet.
Expatriate
December 8th, 2011 at 3:12 am
Excuse me? I, as a civilian, elected to live in Germany just months after working next to the Pentagon and watching, with my own two eyes, that plane fly into the building and kill severalmof my colleagues and neighbors. I had been planning to move long before then for non-political reasons, and I felt pain at leaving my home country at a time when it seemed Americans should be holding together.
But I have never regretted my decision, not in the light of what changes came in the years after that fateful day. If anything, I, as a non-political expatriate, have always felt a sense of ire for those who cheaply throw the words out, "Well, I don't like it, so I'm gonna leave" as a justification for expatriation. That is not how democracy works, and it helps compound rather than resolve real problems. It also makes the huge and erronious assumption that we Americans would be welcome in any other country in the world, and that it would be easy to integrate.
That is precisely why THIS comment riles me up. To ridicule and look down upon those who actually have the chops to back up their lofty idealistic statements with real action is wrong. Political expartiates who live by their credo are very few and far between, and deserve our respect whether you agree with their decision or not, precisely because the reality of moving away is NOT that simple and easy.
I dn't understand why this amount of bitterness is not directed at the source – such as this repealing of basic human rights detailed in the article above – rather than this useless infighting between people who basically agree, yes, this piece of legislature is going too damn far.
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