Dempsey’s Dissent
Joint Chiefs chairman stands up for America — because Obama won't
The President of the United States may not have the cojones to stand up to Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, but the chairman of the Joint Chiefs does — and he’s doing it!
When Gen. Martin Dempsey told British reporters he did not want the US to be “complicit” in an Israeli attack on Iran, the boys in Tel Aviv were crushed. For weeks Netanyahu & Co. had been telling anyone who would listen that the US would have no choice but to be sucked into a devastating regional war in the event of an Israeli first strike on Tehran: their tone was almost gleeful. In the absence of a direct response from the White House, it looked like the Israelis had us over a barrel: the American giant, it seemed, was helpless in the face of the Israeli pygmy’s deft manipulations. Then came Dempsey, whose comments put the kibosh on Israel’s blackmail threats — and threw Netanyahu’s government into a panic:
“Dempsey’s stark comments made clear to the world that Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu was isolated and that if he opted for war, he would jeopardize all-important ties with the Jewish state’s closest ally.
“’Israeli leaders cannot do anything in the face of a very explicit ‘no’ from the U.S. president. So they are exploring what space they have left to operate,’ said Giora Eiland, who served as national security adviser from 2003 to 2006. ‘Dempsey’s announcement changed something. Before, Netanyahu said the United States might not like (an attack), but they will accept it the day after. However, such a public, bold statement meant the situation had to be reassessed.’”
“Dempsey’s announcement changed something” — it’s the understatement of the year, perhaps the decade. Because this is the first time since the days of George Herbert Walker Bush that a major player has reminded that Shitty Little Country of its littleness. For months, the Israelis have been going around acting like they are the superpower, and we are a minuscule dependency relying entirely on our patron’s generosity — and endless forbearance.
Or maybe not so endless, at least as far as the US military is concerned. You’ll recall that in the run up to the invasion of Iraq, a number of high-ranking officers spoke out in public against the lunacy of believing we could march in and turn the place into an American suburb. They questioned the low-ball estimates of troop strength and other resources required for an extended occupation, and the neocons were telling them to get back into their barracks.
They don’t like Dempsey much, and after this they’ll like him much less: in their eyes he’s just a tool of the Obama administration. Yet even if this is true, and Gen. Dempsey is speaking out at the behest of the White House, haven’t we come to a sorry pass when the President of the United States cannot speak in his own name and on his own authority about an issue vital to our national security? What a testament to the power of the Israel Lobby. Not bad for a pressure group that supposedly doesn’t even exist.
The real problem, however, is that Dempsey in all probability is speaking for himself, and didn’t require any prompting from the White House. Nor is this the first time the military has signaled its opposition to striking Iran. With US military assets in the region vulnerable to an Iranian counterattack, I wouldn’t be surprised if those alleged secret contacts between Washington and Tehran (via European intermediaries) were made at the military’s insistence: the first instinct of a commander, after all, is to protect his troops. In effect, the Israelis, by constantly threatening a first strike at Tehran, are holding the tens of thousands of US military personnel in the region hostage — because they will be likely targets of an Iranian counterattack. With the White House maintaining radio silence on this issue, Dempsey and the generals had no choice but to go public in order to protect their own.
There was a time when the separation of the military and the civilian in politics was strictly observed. While a soldier can still be disciplined for speaking at a Ron Paul rally, the higher ups have a bit more leeway. In the age of empire, the dissolution of the bright line between the civilian and the military is only a matter of time: what’s interesting, however, is that no would-be Caesar has arisen to personify the militarist spirit — although I wouldn’t rule it out. Instead, those military figures who have taken a public stance on these matters almost universally urge caution and restraint.
With back to back deployments, and two wars without a victory, what does the Pentagon have to look forward to but a third war, one which promises to be regional in scope. Little wonder they’re beginning to make their opposition known.
Dempsey can’t be the only soldier who resents taking marching orders from Netanyahu — and dreads the onset of Netanyahu’s war. This has got to be a restraining factor on the Obama administration, which prevents them from completely capitulating to Israeli demands.
Let’s hope the peaceniks in the Pentagon can hold the fort, because Obama and the Democrats raised the white flag of surrender to the War Party long ago. Here is the most recent edition of the Democratic party platform on the question of war with Iran:
“The President is committed to using all instruments of national power to prevent Iran from acquiring nuclear weapons. … President Obama believes that a diplomatic outcome remains the best and most enduring solution. At the same time, he has also made clear that the window for diplomacy will not remain open indefinitely and that all options — including military force — remain on the table. But we have an obligation to use the time and space that exists now to put increasing pressure on the Iranian regime to live up to its obligations and rejoin the community of nations, or face the consequences.”
While the platform admits “the Iranians have yet to build a nuclear weapon” it goes on to assert they “cannot demonstrate with any credibility that [their] program is peaceful.” Iran is guilty until proven innocent — and the standard of proof is impossible. Because the Americans, egged on by the Israelis, will always be asking “How do we know you aren’t hiding something from us?” As for evidence, it can always be manufactured, although the key question here is: evidence of what?
The Israelis have set a new standard when it comes to Iran. They insist the red line must be the “breakout” capability, as estimated by Tel Aviv’s strategists, of course: that is, the moment when Tehran can theoretically throw together a nuclear weapon of some sort on very short notice.
The catch is that this point exists in theory only: there is no solid evidence the Iranians are pursuing nuclear weapons, and indeed the official US assessment is that they gave up all such attempts in 2003, and haven’t resumed. There have been all sorts of rumors that a new intelligence assessment was in the works, but so far it hasn’t surfaced. The clear implication is that, as in the Iraq misadventure, key elements of the intelligence community are refusing to drink the Israeli Kool-Aid: Dempsey’s dissent is the first unequivocal and clear voice raised against the prospect of fighting an unnecessary war for Israel’s sake.
You won’t find that in the Democratic platform.
Read more by Justin Raimondo
- Antiwar.com vs. the FBI – May 21st, 2013
- Two Cheers for ‘Isolationism’ – May 19th, 2013
- Our Civil Liberties, RIP – May 16th, 2013
- Raping the World – May 14th, 2013
- The Price of Peace – May 12th, 2013





MvGuy
September 4th, 2012 at 9:46 pm
"Dempsey’s dissent is the first unequivocal and clear voice raised against the prospect of fighting an unnecessary war for Israel’s sake."
Should read:
"Dempsey’s dissent is the first unequivocal and clear voice raised against the prospect of fighting another unnecessary war for Israel’s sake."
davidgrayling
September 4th, 2012 at 9:56 pm
Let's hope that Dempsey's dissent is not a Gulf of Tonkin incident! Let's hope that Obama is not pretending the U.S. is a reluctant partner to Israel. Let's hope that Obama is not trying to put off Israel's intention to nuke Iran until after November and then it's all systems go!
I almost can't dare to believe that the U.S. is finally comes to its senses regarding Israel, that it is finally recognizing that it has created a monster!
Time will tell, I guess. With the U.S., you can never tell what mischief it's up to!
Johnny in Wi.
September 4th, 2012 at 10:48 pm
Dempsey remembers that lots of Germans general officers were hung after WW2 for partaking in agressive war. Pre-emtive and preventive wars are horrible war crimes. This officer is remembering his oath to the Constitution and warning the Israeli's and their local goons that he and a lot of others will not partake in such crimes. What if the politicians gave an order for war and that was clearly illegal and the armed forces refused to obey them? We can only hope for that day.
Another Guest
September 4th, 2012 at 11:30 pm
Well this entire analysis is pure fantasy…"peaceniks in the pentagon"…?…really now…
First of all…the military does not make political policy…it is beyond a shadow of doubt that Obama was speaking through Dempsey's mouth…
There is no such thing as dissent in this empire…if Raimondo does not see that this in an imperium where even the tiniest detail is scrupulously scripted then his powers of observation are none too keen…
Sure we would all like to believe that someone in the military is finally speaking out and saying enough is enough…come on folks…do you even realize how silly that sounds…the skeptical comments here are much more astute than this column…
This is just another good cop bad cop routine…nothing is going to change…Iran will continue to be the target of illegal embargoes designed to soften it up for an eventual military assault…the media will continue to demonize…and Israel is playing the role of attack dog…
All of this is perfectly scripted…even Israel's supposedly loose cannon role…
james
September 5th, 2012 at 2:10 am
The sorry state of the American Empire, one soldier lets out a small beep against the shit*ylittlestate's war and everybody is so happy and jumping for joy. What abysmal state of affairs. The only acceptable and laudable action by the US military now would be to overtly and covertly neutralize the nuclear arsenal of that state. Anything less than this would only defer the problem. And it would be easy because they are proven cowards.
One very positive aspect of this column today is Justin's referral to Israel with its real true name, the shitty little country.
Kelley V
September 5th, 2012 at 3:15 am
"Another Guest" said: "There is no such thing as dissent in this empire."
That is not true. There may be little of it, but it is there, and it must be embraced — and exploited — when it is found. For whatever reason, Dempsey said these things — whether it was pure "dissent" or proxy for the White House we do not know. But nothing happens in Washington without a reason. Thank you Justin for a great analysis.
Strider55
September 5th, 2012 at 3:20 am
Note the conspicuous presence of the word "complicit" in Dempsey's statement. Then check out its dictionary definition. I'd say the general does indeed see visions of nooses (or life in prison) dancing in his head.
Regarding the military's possible refusal to obey orders to start an illegal war: For that to happen, IMHO Dempsey would need the support of the rest of the JCS, plus hundreds of other officers at least as far down the ranks as colonel. Otherwise the Ozombies would depose them and carry out the orders. The ideal outcome, of course, would be the final collapse of the Yankee Empire and the breakup of the US. Recall how the USSR fell apart in 1991 — Boris Yeltsin was able to persuade the Red Army not to back the hard-line Communists' coup against Gorbachev. When the coup imploded, so did the whole rotten edifice.
Augustbrhm
September 5th, 2012 at 3:29 am
obama will not allow this piddleyass made up bastion that they themselves helped to create dictate to them dempsey is right on the money let us assist those zionist in america and israel to hell in a handbasket .
After US Rebuke, Israel Scrambles to Climb Down From War Rhetoric – Antiwar « Stop Making Sense
September 5th, 2012 at 3:43 am
[...] Gen. Martin Dempsey’s comments last week laid out an extremely clear US opposition, Israeli officials are scrambling to re-frame their incredibly hawkish statements on attacking [...]
Is Obama a Pinko Commie? (and other news…) » Scott Lazarowitz's Blog
September 5th, 2012 at 4:32 am
[...] Justin Raimondo: Dempsey’s Dissent [...]
Didi
September 5th, 2012 at 4:59 am
Giora Eiland has a much better understanding of what happened than Mr. Raimondo. The General's statement was undoubtedly vetted if not initiated by the White House. That has nothing to do with the cojones of the President. Bibi knows very well that General Dempsey spoke for the US President.
Phil Giraldi
September 5th, 2012 at 5:38 am
Great article Jusin but Didi has it right – Dempsey would not have said what he said to include the precise language used without complete approval from the White House. Obama is clearly buying himself some political space by having the general speak out with some ambiguity as to whether he is actually speaking for the president. He does not want the media to turn on him so to all intents and purposes he is maintaining all appearances of a hard line towards Iran while signalling to the Israelis that they must not start a war. Whether this will hold when Bibi comes to Washington at the end of the month and pressures both the president and Romney remains to be seen.
musings
September 5th, 2012 at 6:08 am
Really? Even monoliths have flaws. We are not yet at the point where dissenters are "disappeared." To imagine that we have reached that point is a greater stretch than that someone disagrees with a course of action which could endanger thousands of US troops under his command or potential command. For an American to say that another country is trying to force our hand is hardly an act of lese majeste, unless you believe that Israel really IS in the driver's seat. Apparently it isn't.
While I realize that there is a lot of kabuki around a political campaign and that the loyalty of the major media is pretty much with the incumbent this time around, it seems that when CNN reporters note differences in the 2012 DNC platform from the 2008 platform which explicitly scale back the adoption of Israel's viewpoint regarding Jerusalem and other matters, perhaps this also indicates some change at another level in response to the Likudniks' arrogant attitudes.
It may also signal that some who care about the future of Israel understand that a war with Iran is more dangerous than engaging in dialogue. They may be in the minority in Israel, but probably not among Obama voters who are Jewish. If this is the case, and I would imagine that alienating such voters is the last thing the Democrats want to do by scaling back their enthusiasm for Israel in the platform, then perhaps indeed Dempsey is tolerated if not actually prompted by the Obama administration for his remarks. If memory serves, a general who shoots off his mouth in a way which displeases the administration can be removed – cf. Douglas MacArthur. Big egos are not tolerated in the military unless they serve the purposes of the administration.
Similarly, platform changes from one campaign to the next are probably not accepted by an incumbent candidate unless they reflect a policy shift. Now perhaps that shift is in response to the attitudes of the opponent, which may be less gung-ho than his predecessor towards Israel (McCain actually sang "Bomb, Bomb Iran" to the Beach Boys' tune "Barbara Ann"), but perhaps such change goes deeper into the actions of the administration which may have some realistic sense that another war is dangerous and unsustainable. It's definitely a signal to Netanyahu to shut the hell up. Whether he does or not is his own lookout.
Donna
September 5th, 2012 at 7:08 am
I have to conquer with your assessment. Dempsey answers to Obama and if he were truly dissenting, he'd lose his job. I believe most of this business is subterfuge to keep everyone guessing: will they or won't they attack Iran…
Dr.Khan
September 5th, 2012 at 7:32 am
Have said that,''complicit'' word,if Gen Dempsy is on his own then it simply means that the wars fought so far has simply bracketed all previous Generals and Presidents plus Oblownba,War Criminals.for which their should be assured punishment atleast by ICC.
As for Israel,they have depended on US for their all illegit goals to achieve for the last 40 years atleast,and just one small sentence would wash it away.Not so easy dudes.as someone said in his comments,there is always a mischief in the making for rounding USG.So let's see if there is any big one in the making like Killing Obama,as we all know to which extent Zionst can march to achieve the ultimate Heights.
If USG opted for war against Iran which such clear stance from the Armed forces boss then we expect First ever Marshall Law in the USA.
Therefore even if Gen.Dempsy is ray of light at the same time the others are not sitting idle and will not counter this nightmare either.
We all know the baseless assumption so far created for going into previous wars.This will be no different either,if ever opted to go for.It's just th outcome that will be for sure not only different but very very BAD this time for all sides.
So far all I will say is God bless Ron Paul and his newly born twin brother with SENSES i.e Gen.Dempsy with just one request forwarded to The Gen.Please meet frequently with Gen.Kiyani and try wrap up the war in Afghanistan,those people and the region as a whole want peace and are very tired of these useless wars and killings.
Generalissimo X
September 5th, 2012 at 9:05 am
well it does seem by all accounts obama just told bibi to shove it. good for him. i see this speculation that there is some back room deal about after the election but i have several problems with that. first, there is no guarantee that obama even wins in november at this point. both candidates are awful corporate bag men and i loathe them both, that said, it's pretty much a toss up in my mind as to which one of these stooges will be in charge come november. second, and i'm willing to concede this may be wishful thinking and them some, but maybe, just maybe reason is going to prevail for once.
fox fallon and his crew awhile back war gamed an iran scenario and it ended in disaster over and over again. dempsey i'm sure is aware of this, ditto the pentagon and obama. our economy is in shambles and is literally teetering on a cliff. an attack on iran would cause them to retaliate as much as they are able, and it does seem they have some capabilities. hezbollah would certainly become active both in the middle east and perhaps even in the u.s. tel aviv would burn, jerusalem would burn and so would the israeli economy. the straits of hormuz would be volatile to say the least and the oil shock here would be untenable. there would literally be riots in the streets as our economy went up in flames about as fast as tehran. then there is china and russia…nukes start getting lobbed around and they are just going to sit there? yeah right. everyone better hope that what's happening "real". any war with iran will be the end of our economy and most likely our country.
Generalissimo X
September 5th, 2012 at 9:08 am
fox fallon dissented several years back and by all accounts that kept cheney and his monsters at bay against iran. while i agree there is always double dealing and disinfo so to speak, to assert that it's all a perfect script is ridiculous. peaceniks in the pentagon, doubtful as such. that said, they know a strategic and military disaster waiting to happen when they see one. an iran attack has been war gamed over and over again…and guess what..we lose.
San Fernando Curt
September 5th, 2012 at 10:22 am
I'm siding with argument Obama spoke through Dempsey – but only as delaying tactic until after the election. Giveaway line is in that party platform excerpt, "…We have an obligation to use the time and space that exists now to put increasing pressure on the Iranian regime to live up to its obligations and rejoin the community of nations, or face the consequences.” Obligation to who? A more honest phrasing probably would be, "We are absolutely committed to removing Israel's last state foes in the Middle East." But I'm sure the idea got across to Tel Aviv and the Lobby.
liberranter
September 5th, 2012 at 11:19 am
I would love to believe that principle will reassert itself and that Dempsey, the rest of the JCS, and indeed most of the senior office corps of the U.S. armed forces will refuse to obey an unlawful executive order to attack Iran (or assist Amerika's Israeli overlords in doing so). However, nearly two decades of experience as a seagoing legionnaire doesn't allow me to be so optimistic. At the time I left the service (just before the turn of the century), the officer corps consisted in the main of politicized, careerist arse lickers who had all the collective moral fiber of an organized crime family. Given the overall sociopolitical deterioration since then, it defies logic to believe that things have improved or that a new-found respect for the Constitution has arisen within the ranks. The invasions of Iraqghanistan over the last decade have, by themselves, disproved any such assertion.
The only way that the Pentagram might conceivably refuse to carry out an executive order to attack Iran is if the threat of nuclear exchange looms large and clear. Even then, most of the self-centered psychopaths who dominate the upper echelons of the military establishment would probably remain undeterred by the specter of civilizational destruction.
patriothere
September 5th, 2012 at 11:24 am
Dempsey is no hero. We should thank him for not sending the world into the abyss for no reason at all whatsoever? Gee, thanks marty! It's his job. He should not be commended for just doing his job.
patriothere
September 5th, 2012 at 11:32 am
The military has gotten intelligence that says Israel is going to attack Iran. Unilaterally. So what they have done in a pathetic move, is say to the Iranians, we are not behind this. They did this all on their own. Yeah right. Like they will beleive that! It wont work American interests will be hit and Israel is not being reigned in by anybody. My bet is that they will start a regional war by invadin lebanon and that spilling over into Syria, drawing Iran in.
patriothere
September 5th, 2012 at 11:32 am
The military has gotten intelligence that says Israel is going to attack Iran. Unilaterally. So what they have done in a pathetic move, is say to the Iranians, we are not behind this. They did this all on their own. Yeah right. Like they will beleive that! It wont work American interests will be hit and Israel is not being reigned in by anybody. My bet is that they will start a regional war by invadin lebanon and that spilling over into Syria, drawing Iran in.
heathroi
September 5th, 2012 at 11:33 am
Its not really a surprise that Barry got Dempsey tell the Isrealis to pipe down. Barry doesn't want any surprises on the way to Election day and sending Tel Aviv to the naughty step would be giving a gift to Romney, And really who on the republican side is going to criticise the chairman of the general staff
Johnny in Wi.
September 5th, 2012 at 12:09 pm
Phil: That will be the day we will see who stoops lower ot kiss Netanyahu's rear end Romney or Obama. Both of them will have to do it or else their masters will get upset. Romney could have done himself a world of good if he had promised to end the war in Afganistan immediatly in his speech last week. Instead he said nothing except the usual Neocon claptrap. We will see if Obama does differently this week. It is probably Obama's only chance to energize his discouraged base and get them to come out and vote for him.
mickperry
September 5th, 2012 at 12:17 pm
Mitt happens, an interesting question. and here's another one. Is Bibi due to give an address to the USA's parliament again also?
sherban
September 5th, 2012 at 12:18 pm
Good article but Justin wrote:"and indeed the official US assessment is that they gave up all such attempts in 2003, and haven’t resumed. "Why to believe that American agencies spoke the truth even partial?It is very possible that accusing Iran of nuclear weapon activity they justify US anti Iranian policy,sabotages until 2003 and even now because apparently Iranians lied us.I believe more in Kamenay fatwa that nuclear weapon is anti Islam so they non in the past and not now want to get it.
Roger
September 5th, 2012 at 1:12 pm
Wow, are they paying you to make intelligent comments finally?
It's so much better than the comment you're famous for.
6 minutes ago @ Breitbart.com – Protests to greet Ahma… · 1 reply · 0 points
I'm like jesus, I'm gonna chase you money changers out of the temple and out of town and of course out of this forum. Me and ohsoquiet and a few other REAL AMERICANS who are being PAID to be here like you Israeli PR men. I'm here to chase you filth out.
Roger
September 5th, 2012 at 1:14 pm
Israel maintains they have a right to survive and defend themselves against anyone who wants to 'erase' them.
Another Guest
September 5th, 2012 at 1:19 pm
Yes I agree…Raimondo is showing some gumption by calling that putrid little country by its proper descriptor…
But I think he is going to find some "dissenters" right here on this website…including Thomas A. Knapp…the comments czar here…who proudly calls himself an "open Zionist…"…not to mention the redoubtable Ms. Keaton…the editorial gatekeeper here who has blacklisted stalwarts like Paul Craig Roberts…Siebel Edmonds…and many others…who dare take issue with the Putrid Little Country,,,
I don't expect this comment will live here very long…which proves my point…
ML3
September 5th, 2012 at 3:13 pm
Same goes for the Iranians, right?
Are you on board with the Israelis whomever they want to butcher? If a long list of innocent dead Arab/Muslims doesn't excite you, then certainly the following IDF child abuse-bonanza put out by former soldiers should do the trick:
'What Our Society Is Made of': Former IDF Soldiers Confess Abuse of Palestinian Children
http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2012/08/27-3
ML3
September 5th, 2012 at 3:13 pm
Same goes for the Iranians, right?
Are you on board with the Israelis whomever they want to butcher? If a long list of innocent dead Arab/Muslims excites you, then certainly the following IDF child abuse-scum bonanza put out by former soldiers will no doubt have you reaching for the Vaseline.
'What Our Society Is Made of': Former IDF Soldiers Confess Abuse of Palestinian Children
<a href="http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2012/08/27-3” target=”_blank”>www.commondreams.org/headline/2012/08/27-3
ML3
September 5th, 2012 at 3:13 pm
Same goes for the Iranians, right?
Are you on board with whomever the Israelis wish to butcher? If a long list of innocent dead Arab/Muslims excites you, then certainly the following IDF child abuse-scum bonanza put out by former soldiers will no doubt have you reaching for the Vaseline.
'What Our Society Is Made of': Former IDF Soldiers Confess Abuse of Palestinian Children
<a href="http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2012/08/27-3” target=”_blank”>www.commondreams.org/headline/2012/08/27-3
Remember, this site is called ANTIWAR.COM…
Run to Fox News and join all the other armchair War Parrots and their circle jerk.
musings
September 5th, 2012 at 3:54 pm
News items side by side tonight: 1) It is reported that Dempsey, in Afghanistan at this moment (Sept. 5), arrived in a plane which was afterward hit by shrapnel (it is said he was in his office when this happened), and 2) Obama has reached in and changed the Democratic party platform to assert that Jerusalem is the capital of Israel (although most are speaking about the other plank added to the platform, that there is a God or some such assertion). Funny how things kind of coincide this way. If, all of a sudden, Dempsey decides to retire or is replaced, we'll see how powerful Israel remains in US politics and how likely it is that we will be drawn into a war with Iran.
Outsider
September 5th, 2012 at 5:42 pm
I recently saw Dinesh D'Souza's documentary "2016." Although I didn't buy into much of it, I'm hoping there is a grain of truth in D'Souza's hypothesis that Obama's beliefs regarding colonialism are the same as his absent father. If D'Souza is correct, then Obama's real unstated sentiments lie with Iran and not Israel. This line of reasoning leads me to suspect that Obama may be using Gen Dempsey to buy time with Israel, trying to hold off an October surprise, until after the election. Once Obama secures reelection (I still think the only chance to avoid further mideast wars) he would then be free to put Bibi in his place. One can only hope.
Outsider
September 5th, 2012 at 6:02 pm
If, during his acceptance speech, Obama says that we will have Israel's back, no matter what, then at least the anti-war wing of his base will be demoralized, possibly costing him the election. However, I think Obama is too smart to fall into this trap. I'm hoping that when Natanyahu come visiting this fall that, behind closed doors, Obama reads him the riot act about starting a war before the election. Then, after the election, Obama will be free to really put him in his place. Or am I hopelessly naive?
Strider55
September 5th, 2012 at 6:14 pm
I'm more hopeful than optimistic as well (spent 8 years in the USAF), but pessimism only leaves one depressed and hopeless (which, I suspect, is how the regime wants us to feel). <a href="http://www.amazon.com/Jefferson-Project-Thor-Duffin/dp/0615371272/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1346892696&sr=1-1&keywords=jefferson+project">This excellent novel features, among other things, an incipient military coup against an incompetent black president whose white wife is the "power behind the throne" (imagine Ozero married to Hillary, and you'll get the idea). Perhaps Dempsey and other generals have also read it and have at least considered using it as a template.
At any rate, today's top brass are a lot saner than their 1950s-60s counterparts, Curtis LeMay, among others, truly salivated at the thought of a nuclear war vs. the Soviets. In fact, he was the partial inspiration for the fictional James Mattoon Scott.
“What if the democracy we thought we were serving no longer exists, and the Republic has become the very evil we’ve been fighting to destroy?” — Senator Padmé Amidala
Strider55
September 5th, 2012 at 6:14 pm
I'm more hopeful than optimistic as well (spent 8 years in the USAF), but pessimism only leaves one depressed and hopeless (which, I suspect, is how the regime wants us to feel). This excellent novel features, among other things, an incipient military coup against an incompetent black president whose white wife is the "power behind the throne" (imagine Ozero married to Hillary, and you'll get the idea). Perhaps Dempsey and other generals have also read it and have at least considered using it as a template.
At any rate, today's top brass are a lot saner than their 1950s-60s counterparts, Curtis LeMay, among others, truly salivated at the thought of a nuclear war vs. the Soviets. In fact, he was the partial inspiration for the fictional James Mattoon Scott.
“What if the democracy we thought we were serving no longer exists, and the Republic has become the very evil we’ve been fighting to destroy?” — Senator Padmé Amidala
Outsider
September 5th, 2012 at 6:23 pm
Just a thought, Justin, if you happen to read this post. I've been reading your articles for several months now and have become a real fan. I first heard about you from your sporadic columns on lewrockwell.com and appearances on the lamentedly late Judge's 'Freedom Watch.' I am also a HUGE fan of Pat Buchanan, have read most of his books, and never miss reading his twice weekly columns. I know he is not libertarian (often called a paleoconservative) but your views appear to be totally in synch on useless wars and the empire. I think it would be great if you wrote an article about your views vis a vi Buchanan. Woud be VERY interesting.
Roger
September 5th, 2012 at 7:20 pm
When Israel threatens to erase an entire country simply out of bigotry and religious hatred, then I'll say the same for them.
And I would love it if there was no war, if Israel could lay down it's arms and trust the peace to follow.
Roger
September 5th, 2012 at 7:20 pm
When Israel threatens to erase an entire country simply out of bigotry and religious hatred, then I'll say the same for them.
And I would love it if there was no war, if Israel could lay down it's arms and trust the peace to follow.
When you want to just pretend Israel deserves to die, and should volunteer, that's not anti-war. That's just genocide. I hope you do keep in mind the better alternative to war is a true and lasting peace.
Donna
September 5th, 2012 at 8:41 pm
Once one gets past the plethora of disinformation and subterfuge, one thing remains quite clear, the main disagreement (if that is the word) between Israel and the US, isn't so much about whether or not to attack Iran but rather WHEN to attack Iran.
who
September 5th, 2012 at 9:00 pm
.. Bastiat, Smith,.FDouglas,Jefferson,Booker,T,Washington, Mises, Hayek, Ayn Rand, Rothbard,Malcolm X,Ron Paul all these people and many more…..
Another Guest
September 5th, 2012 at 9:49 pm
You want to tallk about "erasing…"…how many Palestinian homes has Israel erased…?…how many entire Palestinian villages has Israel erased…?
How many Palestinian lives…men…women…children…has Israel erased…?
How many UN Security Council Resolutions has Israel erased…?
This is a rogue state that has been practicing genocide for 65 years…when someone from Iran says that this has to stop…then what is wrong with that…?
And btw…Iran has never threatened to erase Israel or the Israeli people…the words were that "the Zionist regime must vanish from the pages of time…"
That is simply regime change…which the US and Israel did last year in Libya…and is doing right now in Syria…what's sauce for the goose…is sauce for the gander…
one
September 5th, 2012 at 10:19 pm
Like I say, If you choose a side, you are guaranteed to be on the wrong one.
who
September 5th, 2012 at 10:41 pm
You know what would be even more interesting…is if you wrote your views compared to Napolian. Not that I think, you're different, but the similarities are so striking, maybe even some Benedict Arnold added for show.
In sync on useless wars and empire is it. The same useless bastards, who parade themselves as saviors of the planet the same worthless fucks who couldn't care less, have the audacity to say that the military is wrong while their worthless asses are right.
At least the military can proclaim they are bringing democracy to the world while the rest the greens and others bring fascism to the planet. Sorry but the military seems to be able to one up you on so called "humanitarian" bullshit. Not that I agree with either, you all suck.
one
September 5th, 2012 at 10:45 pm
Antiwar, the last hold out of free speech has to approve my post.
The marriage of Adam and Eve was the start of a Lineage.
SAD drastično smanjuju predviđene zajedničke vojne vježbe s Izraelom i šalju Davida Petraeusa u Izrael da ublaži posljedice ove odluke | HBportal.info
September 6th, 2012 at 1:04 am
[...] želim sudjelovati ako Izrael odluči napasti”). Justin Raimondo, kolumnist lista Anti-War, smatra kako je komentar Martina Dempseya “jedna od najvažnijih izjava [...]
Curious
September 6th, 2012 at 1:52 am
The United States has too much on its plate right now and the military is too stretched and worn out for there to be a war with Iran. I think Obama's goal is to break Iran through sanctions and then when the military is prepared for war there will be war (whenever that will be). Iraq was a mess after a decade of sanctions. I think Romney will jump into war with both feet right after being elected regardless if the military thinks that it is prepared to handle a war with Iran. Reality doesn't matter to Republicans. They invent their own.
liberal
September 6th, 2012 at 5:42 am
"First of all…the military does not make political policy…it is beyond a shadow of doubt that Obama was speaking through Dempsey's mouth…"
Agreed.
Sam Lowry
September 6th, 2012 at 5:54 am
"There is no such thing as dissent in this empire…"
We may be pawns on a chess board, but that does not mean there is only one chess player. Our rulers may see us plebeians as nothing but a resource to be exploited, but that does not mean they are of one mind, or that the parasites are too eager to kill their host.
I don't believe for a second that Obama was speaking through Dempsey's mouth. I think Obama is just as much a puppet as Dempsey.
"Presidents don't have power; their job is to draw attention away from it." — Ford Prefect
Scared of Leaks, Netanyahu Mulls Forcing Cabinet to Take Polygraphs – Antiwar « Stop Making Sense
September 6th, 2012 at 6:29 am
[...] seen months of war rhetoric imperiled by recent US criticism, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu appears to be growing even more [...]
phildem
September 6th, 2012 at 7:27 am
I really like antiwar.com, and Justin's coverage of antiwar news, but in this age of hyperlinks, and micro-blogging a clear evocative headline is key to getting peoples attention, with cross posting articles. I often find that linking to Jason's article results in obscurely named hyperlinks.
"Joint Chiefs chairman dissents" makes a more informative hyper-blurb, than "Dempsey Dissents".
I really value the antiwar narrative, but trying to educate and inform TV news watching family, friends and acquaintances means trying to entice them with hyperlinks posted to social media. It's difficult to do that with contemporary political erudition. Not to suggest inflammatory tabloid headlines, but giving some thought to having a micro-blogging friendly 'lede' in the headline may help extend the antiwar message.
Justin Raimondo
September 6th, 2012 at 8:41 am
Good point. I try, but don't always succeed. One problem is that by the time I get to thinking up a headline, there's five minutes left to my deadline — yes, we have deadlines!
Generalissimo X
September 6th, 2012 at 8:55 am
so israel will start a war to prevent a war? go look up the words paradox and contradiction and get back to the rest of us. the fact is iran has never threatened any such thing, but of course don't let facts get in the way of your worked up msm style hysteria.
here's a link, send it to all your genius friends. http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/17/israe…
Madeline Albright
September 6th, 2012 at 8:57 am
democracy at the end of a gun barrel. some type of awesomeness there. i guess the peace corps never occurred to you?
Roger
September 6th, 2012 at 9:12 am
Too many homes and lives have been disrupted and interrupted.
Let's take a look at yesterday's headlines, shall we?
http://www.knoxnews.com/news/2012/sep/05/israeli-…
Where would you lay the blame for these deaths? And more importantly why?
Roger
September 6th, 2012 at 9:12 am
Too many homes and lives have been disrupted and interrupted.
Let's take a look at yesterday's headlines, shall we?
http://www.knoxnews.com/news/2012/sep/05/israeli-…
Where would you lay the blame for these deaths? And more importantly why?
Roger
September 6th, 2012 at 9:16 am
Iran has threatened to Erase Israel. http://www.timesofisrael.com/irans-nuclear-progra…
Of course that's a Jewish source so you will ignore it. http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/26/world/africa/26…
Even as a liberal rag, it might be run or owned by Jews so you'll ignore that one too. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9zcElqetqk
Is video of the president saying it himself better?
Curious
September 6th, 2012 at 10:24 am
My response is this: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/arti…
and this: http://antiwar.com/radio/2008/10/13/lawrence-wilk…
Roger
September 6th, 2012 at 10:31 am
How is that a response to the issue at hand exactly?
An article from 2003?
And interview in 2008?
How does that have any bearing on a video of the Achmed guy saying what he did about his plans for Israel?
Curious
September 6th, 2012 at 10:43 am
The "Achmed guy" does not control Iranian foreign policy. He is just a talking fool. He is the Iranian version of Biden.
It is a response because the Iranians were willing to deal and Bush gave them the finger and Obama is giving them the finger. They were willing to talk about the nuclear program and they were open to being nice to the Israelis.
Roger
September 6th, 2012 at 1:11 pm
He's a talking head. He wouldn't be allowed to say that unless it was policy.
guest
September 6th, 2012 at 2:48 pm
But they have. Not only have the threatened the entire palestinian nation but they have threatned to suicide the entire middle east. ___ _http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/02/16/AR2006021601897.html
patriothere
September 6th, 2012 at 2:51 pm
I lay the blame on israel. of course.
patriothere
September 6th, 2012 at 2:51 pm
He never said it.
patriothere
September 6th, 2012 at 2:52 pm
He has no plans. They have no plans. What are you talking about?
patriothere
September 6th, 2012 at 2:53 pm
It's not policy. Where have they invaded? Where have the threatened? Israel is the rogue nation.
Roger
September 6th, 2012 at 3:00 pm
Yes you would, but as a paid hack you have no choice in the matter.
6 minutes ago @ Breitbart.com – Protests to greet Ahma… · 1 reply · 0 points
I'm like jesus, I'm gonna chase you money changers out of the temple and out of town and of course out of this forum. Me and ohsoquiet and a few other REAL AMERICANS who are being PAID to be here like you Israeli PR men. I'm here to chase you filth out.
Roger
September 6th, 2012 at 3:00 pm
Is it? You conveniently forget this.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Palestinian_…
Roger
September 6th, 2012 at 3:01 pm
Go back to sleep.
Roger
September 6th, 2012 at 3:01 pm
A video says otherwise.
patriothere
September 6th, 2012 at 3:26 pm
WHy do you post at all if you are not here to have a serious discussion?
patriothere
September 6th, 2012 at 3:27 pm
You forgot that the israelis drove them from their homes and are occupying land that isn't theirs. Like Helen Thomas said, get out of palestine and go back to poland.
patriothere
September 6th, 2012 at 3:28 pm
You are not a serious mind looking for serious minds to exchange ideas with. You are stubborn and set in your ways and wont allow anybody to reason with you.
patriothere
September 6th, 2012 at 3:28 pm
No it doesn't.
Roger
September 6th, 2012 at 3:37 pm
Yes, it does.
Roger
September 6th, 2012 at 3:38 pm
Of course I am. If you're ever taken off your leash and tempted to try it, then let me know.
But as a paid hack/rented mouth you really have no choice in what you say.
6 minutes ago @ Breitbart.com – Protests to greet Ahma… · 1 reply · 0 points
I'm like jesus, I'm gonna chase you money changers out of the temple and out of town and of course out of this forum. Me and ohsoquiet and a few other REAL AMERICANS who are being PAID to be here like you Israeli PR men. I'm here to chase you filth out.
Roger
September 6th, 2012 at 3:38 pm
No, they existed side by side as long as possible. There is still over a million arabs within Israel.
Roger
September 6th, 2012 at 3:39 pm
Why do you think your extremism should go unchallenged?
Oh, you're paid to say so.
Sam
September 6th, 2012 at 4:01 pm
A war with Iran is out of question, because the world economy could not take it. Instead of warmongering , the US should rebuild good relationships with the moslem world, to mutual benefit.
Outsider
September 6th, 2012 at 4:07 pm
I guess it's safe to say, who, that you are not in agreement with the stance of the Anti-war site. But nice to see that you are reading. BTW, Buchanan (as I imagine you don't know) was a high official in both the Nixon And Reagan admins. He also ran for Pres as a Repub against Bush Sr in '92. He is most assuredly not a 'green' nor a lefty in any sense.
Curious
September 6th, 2012 at 11:26 pm
The Iranians charged Ahmadinejad's associates with witchcraft. They don't seem to get along over there: http://abcnews.go.com/International/iranian-presi…
You discount and ignore the links regarding diplomacy. The Iranians were willing to talk about everything and they were rejected. Violence only begats violence. Israel and Iran are both responsible for supporting terrorist. Mossad posed as CIA officers to recruit Jundallah to attack Iranians. I think they shouldn't be posing as CIA officers.
If Iran and Syria are destroyed. Who do you think is next on the Salafi Jihadist list? They are radicalized by how Israel treats the Palestinians. I'm sad my country is dragged in and disfigured by this feud.
Curious
September 6th, 2012 at 11:26 pm
The Iranians charged Ahmadinejad's associates with witchcraft. They don't seem to get along over there: http://abcnews.go.com/International/iranian-presi…
You discount and ignore the links regarding diplomacy. The Iranians were willing to talk about everything and they were rejected. Violence only begats violence. Israel and Iran are both responsible for supporting terrorist. Mossad posed as CIA officers to recruit Jundallah to attack Iranians. I think they shouldn't be posing as CIA officers.
If Iran and Syria are destroyed. Who do you think is next on the Salafi Jihadist list? They are radicalized by how Israel treats the Palestinians. I'm sad my country is dragged in and disfigured by this feud.
Roger
September 7th, 2012 at 12:43 am
Talk with muslims isn't worth the hot air it generates.
Some want a hudna. A chance to talk while they regroup.
And as for getting along with each other, that's a golden observation. islam is 'submission', only they always want to be the one dictating who submits and how they have to do it.
When you have a bunch of inbreds with hot tempers that makes for some interesting moments.
http://islammonitor.org/index.php?option=com_cont…
Roger
September 7th, 2012 at 12:43 am
Talk with muslims isn't worth the hot air it generates.
Some want a hudna. A chance to talk while they regroup.
And as for getting along with each other, that's a golden observation. islam is 'submission', only they always want to be the one dictating who submits and how they have to do it.
When you have a bunch of inbreds with hot tempers that makes for some interesting moments.
http://islammonitor.org/index.php?option=com_cont…
patriothere
September 7th, 2012 at 11:42 am
You say you are a serious mind looking for serious minds to exchange ideas with, yet you stick to your zionist israel firster talking points and never ever stray from them. That is close minded stubborness. Not open minded serious discussion of the issues.
patriothere
September 7th, 2012 at 11:43 am
No they didn't. They drove them from their homes and turned them into refugees.
patriothere
September 7th, 2012 at 11:44 am
They said that same thing about the Radical red chinese. But look at them now. They have hundreds of nuclear weapons, and is Americas biggest trading partner.
patriothere
September 7th, 2012 at 11:44 am
Of course you are not!
patriothere
September 7th, 2012 at 11:44 am
no, it doesn't.
Roger
September 7th, 2012 at 12:01 pm
Poor lard breath.
Are you having a hard time focusing today?
Just clock in and start your day at posting for pay?
Roger
September 7th, 2012 at 12:01 pm
This from lard breath, the paid to post commenter?
Roger
September 7th, 2012 at 12:01 pm
Look lard breath, I'm not sure what you're paid to post about this topic, why not just lay out the talking points?
Roger
September 7th, 2012 at 12:02 pm
There are still over a million arabs within Israel with citizenship rights. They elect representatives to the knesset, or are you allowed to admit that?
Roger
September 7th, 2012 at 12:03 pm
Lard breath, do you really think that deviating from your talking points is a bad thing?
They might dock your pay since you're here to tow the line on your propaganda.
Bikerguy62
September 7th, 2012 at 2:00 pm
Some interesting comments, but all based on what the talking heads are saying. The root of the motivation for this is money; no more, no less. As for Iran's nuclear capabilities, who cares? I could sleep well at night knowing they had a well-developed nuclear arsenal that was ready to go at a moments notice. For them to initiate a nuclear conflict would be suicidal, and they are well aware of this. The real reason Israel wants to attack Iran is to generate more money for their economy. Virtually all of the defense contractors that supply the weaponry of war are owned by Jews. With the war in Iraq and Afghanistan winding down, they aren't seeing as much income being funneled into their economy, so they are ready to start another war to get those ticker tapes moving again. If the war happens to be one that is in Israel's political interest, that's double-coupon day for them. Of course, it's not "politically correct" to make comments like this, and I'm sure I'll get replies accusing me of being anti-semetic, etc., but facts are facts whether or not you hide them behind "political correctness".
A Warning to Israel | Darkmoon
September 8th, 2012 at 1:59 am
[...] shorter edited version of this article by Justin Raimondo, with extensive additional commentary by Lasha Darkmoon on the [...]
A Warning to Israel « Cronici Geruliene
September 9th, 2012 at 8:10 am
[...] Filed under: Uncategorized — mihaibeltechi @ 6:10 pm A shorter edited version of this article by Justin Raimondo, with extensive additional commentary by Lasha Darkmoon on the [...]
A Warning to Israel « Middle East atemporal
September 9th, 2012 at 8:12 am
[...] shorter edited version of this article by Justin Raimondo, with extensive additional commentary by Lasha Darkmoon on the [...]
Eine Warnung an Israel | S I R I U S N E T W O R K
September 14th, 2012 at 11:12 am
[...] kürzer gefasste Version dieses Artikels von Justin Raimondo, mit ausführlichen zusätzlichen Kommentaren von Lasha Darkmoon über [...]
US Envoy: Preparations Made for Attacking Iran -- News from Antiwar.com
September 28th, 2012 at 6:50 pm
[...] but with the Israeli PM seemingly having been all set to start a war in the next month, and much made of the US effort to talk him down, the split is simply too obvious for these denials to be [...]
US Envoy: Preparations Made for Attacking Iran ~ Antiwar « Stop Making Sense
September 29th, 2012 at 12:01 pm
[...] but with the Israeli PM seemingly having been all set to start a war in the next month, and much made of the US effort to talk him down, the split is simply too obvious for these denials to be [...]
US Envoy: Preparations Made for Attacking Iran | SHOAH
September 29th, 2012 at 5:43 pm
[...] but with the Israeli PM seemingly having been all set to start a war in the next month, and much made of the US effort to talk him down, the split is simply too obvious for these denials to be [...]
US Envoy: Preparations Made for Attacking Iran « The Red Phoenix
October 5th, 2012 at 8:34 pm
[...] but with the Israeli PM seemingly having been all set to start a war in the next month, and much made of the US effort to talk him down, the split is simply too obvious for these denials to be [...]
It’s All About Israel « The Ugly Truth
October 10th, 2012 at 7:03 am
[...] Such a scenario could only be disastrous for the region, and for Israel in particular, as Gen. Dempsey, head of the US joint chiefs of staff, has recently made plain. The Israeli defense and [...]
It’s All About Israel | My Catbird Seat
October 10th, 2012 at 7:12 am
[...] Such a scenario could only be disastrous for the region, and for Israel in particular, as Gen. Dempsey, head of the US joint chiefs of staff, has recently made plain. The Israeli defense and [...]
PART II OF “ROOTS OF THE IRANIAN ‘CRISIS’” « Cronici Geruliene
October 10th, 2012 at 11:43 am
[...] Such a scenario could only be disastrous for the region, and for Israel in particular, as Gen. Dempsey, head of the US joint chiefs of staff, has recently made plain. The Israeli defense and [...]
“Roots of the Iranian ‘Crisis” — Part II | SHOAH
October 11th, 2012 at 5:17 am
[...] Such a scenario could only be disastrous for the region, and for Israel in particular, asGen. Dempsey, head of the US joint chiefs of staff, has recently made plain. The Israeli defense and [...]
Why Target Iran? Roots of the Iranian ‘Crisis’ « Counter Information
October 14th, 2012 at 4:41 pm
[...] Such a scenario could only be disastrous for the region, and for Israel in particular, as Gen. Dempsey, head of the US joint chiefs of staff, has recently made plain. The Israeli defense and [...]
The Chickenhawk Meme Is it legitimate? | My Catbird Seat
January 15th, 2013 at 8:56 am
[...] an Israeli attack on Tehran, which – he implied – would inevitably draw in the US. Dempsey’s dissent – calling into question Bibi’s complacent assumption of unconditional American support [...]