I was going to defend Chris Hayes, the MSNBC host whose pre-Memorial Day comments provoked the wingnut-osphere into one of its frequent paroxysms of hate. You can go here to hear his remarks, but the gist of it is he said he hesitated to call each and every one of our soldiers “heroes” because:
“It seems to me that it is so rhetorically proximate to justifications for more war. I don’t want to – obviously – desecrate or disrespect the memory of anyone that’s fallen, and obviously there are individual circumstances in which there is genuine, tremendous heroism, you know, hail of gunfire, rescuing fellow soldiers and things like that. But it seems to me that we marshal this word in a way that is problematic.”
As I said, I was going to defend him, but he apologized so quickly after the chickenhawk brigade started squawking that he’s taken the fun out of the whole project. I’ll note he gave himself an out, in advance, by adding: “But maybe I’m wrong about that.”
This kind of “thoughtful” uncertainty invites attack, and Hayes was certainly the recipient of the typical viciousness that animates such creatures as Ann Coulter, who made some weird comment about “menstruation” – no wonder she’s the mascot of GOP Proud, the gay Republican group. Who else but Ann and/or a drag queen would say something like that?
I’ll defend Hayes anyway, in spite of himself: no doubt his corporate masters at MSNBC forced him to issue his (unconvincing) retraction. And I’ll go him one better: it isn’t just that our troops aren’t heroes, it’s that a good number of them are monsters. Yes, you heard me: monsters. At a time when the US government is rampaging over half the earth, killing thousands and laying waste to what passes for civilization in the Middle East and Central Asia, these guys (and gals) volunteered for military duty. They willingly, and in most cases eagerly, chose to engage in what amounts to mass murder.
Let’s take an emblematic example: Staff Sgt. Robert Bales, who killed 17 Afghan civilians, most of them women and children, in the Panjwai district of Kandahar Province. In the early morning hours of March 11, 14-year-old Rafiullah – a mere slip of a boy – woke to the sound of gunfire. He looked outside and saw an American soldier walking to a shed that housed the family’s prized cow: the soldier opened fire, killing the animal, and then approached the house. Rafiullah did not hesitate. According to the only eyewitness account published in the Western media to date:
“’I told the women inside our room: ‘Let’s run! Let’s get out of here,’” recalled Rafiullah …. In the next compound, a short distance away, Haji Mohammad Naim awoke to the sound of dogs barking wildly in the street.
“Then there was shooting, and the dogs stopped barking,” said Naim, who’s in his 50s.
“Shortly afterward, there was pandemonium at Naim’s front door as Rafiullah and a handful of terrified women and children poured into his yard, seeking shelter. Minutes later, another woman and a young girl emerged from the darkness.
“…Before the shooting ended in Alkozai, Rafiullah’s grandmother was dead, his sister was critically wounded, three other people had been killed, and five others were wounded in three adjacent houses. Most of the victims were related by blood or marriage.
“Naim said he felt rooted to the ground as the shooter bore down on him. Bullets whizzed through the night. The gunfire seemed to come at him in bursts, perhaps as many as 10 shots altogether, Naim recalled, some fired from just feet away. Two struck him in the upper left side of his chest and one ripped skin from the left side of his jaw. Then everything went black.
“The shooter stepped past Naim’s unconscious body and entered his home, confronting Rafiullah and his relatives who’d taken refuge in the main room. With them were around a dozen of Naim’s family members, roused by the gunfire but still half asleep.
“Terror unfolded in the crowded space, the frightened faces of women and children illuminated only by a light that Rafiullah said appeared to be affixed to an assault rifle. The shooter drove everyone before him, herding and hunting his victims like animals.”
Imagine Ann Coulter being woken up at two in the morning by some crazed “hero”! Not that I would wish that on anyone, but humor me here, for a moment, and just imagine: would she go into one of her trademarked rants? Perhaps a smart remark would issue forth from those sneery lips in the moment before she got her head blown off. Or maybe she would simply cry out “My hero!” After all, she is nuts.
I have a question for the wingnut-osphere, however, one they will no doubt neglect to answer: is Bales a hero in their book? And spare me the cries of “isolated incident” – Bales’ rampage is just the latest in a long series of atrocities carried out by our “heroic” centurions. Remember the “Stryker” gang that went around shooting helpless civilians and collecting fragments of bones as “souvenirs”? Should we give those “heroes” a medal?
From the response of the US media to Bales’ arrest, one would think he deserved the congressional Medal of Honor: endless stories about PTSD, his wonderful family, the difficulties of military life, his exemplary record. This barrage of BS has since been replaced by endless stories about his lawyer. As one reporter on Bales’ hometown paper put it: “If I never read another news article about lawyer John Henry Browne or about his diversion strategy in defense of accused Afghan war criminal Robert Bales, it will be too soon.” Browne started out his campaign to exonerate Bales by giving interviews about all the “stress” the poor baby was under after multiple deployments, but as one might expect from such a high-flying legal eagle, he has taken to the media. Bales’ wife went out on the media hustings, giving interviews about what a great father he is and how much he loves children. Which may seem odd, considering the number of children he murdered in cold blood, but in Bizarro World what child-killer doesn’t love children to death?
Browne’s latest stunt: denying the massacre ever took place:
“The lawyer representing a US soldier accused of killing 17 Afghan villagers says ‘he hasn’t seen any proof’ that the massacre took place. John Henry Browne, the civilian attorney representing Staff Sgt. Robert Bales, 38, told Q13-TV in an interview released Wednesday that the military has not shared any evidence with his defense team. ‘There’s no crime scene. There’s no DNA. I’m told that one of the villages where this supposedly happened doesn’t even exist anymore,’ he said.”
Maybe Browne should pay a visit to little Zardana, Rafiullah’s younger sister, who was shot in the head by his client and is now is a US military hospital, partially paralyzed and in urgent need of specialized care. According to Bales’ hometown paper, the News Tribune, her uncle, Juma Khan, said:
“U.S. officials had yet to follow through on a pledge to get her more sophisticated care in the United States. ‘If the Americans can’t organize these simple things, they should return Zardana to us so the world can see her condition,’ he said. ‘If America can’t help us, we will ask the international community for help.’”
The US government doesn’t want the world to see Zardana’s condition, nor does the US media, which has ignored this story except to “report” on what a great guy Bales is. And surely Senor Browne doesn’t want to look into Zardana’s eyes and ask for “proof” the massacre happened. That’s one cross examination I’d love to see.
There is growing evidence the massacre wasn’t just an isolated incident, but part of a larger pattern of “no knock” retaliatory raids conducted by US troops in Afghanistan. Those who are now coming up with exculpatory rationales for Bales’ murderous rampage – and even those who think Bales is monster – take refuge in the argument that his behavior is the exception, and that most of our soldiers are upstanding examples of All That is Good and True. Yet what Bales did is what is occurring on a nationwide scale in Afghanistan: a “special operations” campaign to sow terror among the Afghan populace so that fear outweighs their natural hatred of an occupying army. As our army of “heroes” finds itself bogged down in a war that is neither just nor winnable, the old “COIN” theory of “clear, hold, and build” has given way to a new methodology: subdue, terrorize, and conquer. Bales’ sin was that he went freelance instead of letting his buddies in on the fun.
Chris Hayes is one of the more intelligent cable hosts, and his retraction is unfortunate, albeit involuntary. He was right the first time: the recruits to this Imperial Army are no more “heroes” than Darth Vader’s 501st Legion. Those who think otherwise are either neocons or else are confusing today’s American military with the army of our old republic, which served a strictly defensive function. The military can and should be an honorable profession, and earlier in our storied history it was: that is no longer true.
Instead of defending the United States from attack, military recruits in the 21st century are joining a global Praetorian Guard whose mission is to fight wars of conquest. Rather than standing guard at the border, as they should be, they are busy pushing back the frontiers of the Empire. While not each and every one of them is a war criminal, the conduct of US foreign policy has now reached the point where they are all willing aggressors to some degree or other.
Yes, there are plenty of career officers who disagree with this policy, and resent – even despise – being instruments of Washington’s warlords. However, they can’t speak out in the context of the military, and, short of a military coup, there’s no effective action they can take as long as they’re employed by Uncle Sam.
So they’re faced with a choice: get out, or get with the program. Getting with the program means killing for the glory of the American empire and really loving it. Just like a certain Staff Sergeant we know. In this context, Bales is a hero, and so are all the other Sgt. Bales waiting to happen, straining to be unleashed on a little girl and her brother in the wilds of Afghanistan.
The Bales case is in legal limbo, where the US government and the media (or do I repeat myself?) would like it to stay as long as possible: Browne is challenging the “sanity hearing” process, during which military psychiatrists get to invent reasons why Bales supposedly went off the rails. Browne claims it’s a “fishing expedition.” He’s also challenging the security check civilian lawyers must undergo before appearing in a military court, and so there are more delays.
By the time Bales stands trial the world outside Afghanistan will have forgotten all about his crime. At that point we can safely declare him insane and put him away in an army hospital, where he can live off the proceeds of his defense fund – quite substantial, no doubt – until he’s called to meet his Maker. Which is the only time we’ll see justice served in this case.
Ah, but what a final justice it will be!
Read more by Justin Raimondo
- Two Cheers for ‘Isolationism’ – May 19th, 2013
- Our Civil Liberties, RIP – May 16th, 2013
- Raping the World – May 14th, 2013
- The Price of Peace – May 12th, 2013
- Boycott Israel? – May 9th, 2013





mickperry
May 29th, 2012 at 10:23 pm
I stayed quiet on Monday: uncomfortable about commenting on another nations memorial day. This after all should be a day of introspection for decent people everywhere.
I watched Democracy Now's coverage of those US forces veterans reclaiming and affirming their humanity in front of the NATO meeting in Chicago a week or so earlier, and found it a very moving and powerful spectacle.
There was a story of a young soldier who came home from war explaining to his mother that he was a murderer.
"No, Derrick, you’re in a war. You know, there’s a difference between being in a war and killing somebody and just going up on the street and killing somebody. That’s a murderer."
Derrick Kirkland though knew stuff that his mother could not, and so he took his own life.
Honour the dead, heal the wounded, stop the wars.
Oswaldwasalefty
May 30th, 2012 at 12:31 am
"…The military can and should be an honorable profession, and earlier in our storied history it was: that is no longer true…."
Only the war against the British was it honorable. Otherwise, our forebears picked up where Britain left off with the policy of genocide against the indigenous population. Meanwhile, one could argue our experiment with Republicanism ended, and our Empire began, with the smashing and grab theft of half of Mexico. Nothing honorable about U.S. militarism outside of the Revoluntionary War and the War of 1812.
"By the time Bales stands trial the world outside Afghanistan will have forgotten all about his crime. At that point we can safely declare him insane and put him away in an army hospital, where he can live off the proceeds of his defense fund – quite substantial, no doubt – until he’s called to meet his Maker. Which is the only time we’ll see justice served in this case."
Justin believing a higher power. I guess I'm down with it in this case if he gets to share the same punishment as Christopher Hitchens. LOL.
Oswaldwasalefty
May 30th, 2012 at 12:31 am
"…The military can and should be an honorable profession, and earlier in our storied history it was: that is no longer true…."
Only the war against the British during the origins of this country could be considered honorable. Otherwise, our forebears picked up where Britain left off with the policy of genocide against the indigenous population. Meanwhile, one could argue our experiment with Republicanism ended, and our Empire began, with the smashing and grab theft of half of Mexico. Nothing honorable about U.S. militarism outside of the Revoluntionary War and the War of 1812.
"By the time Bales stands trial the world outside Afghanistan will have forgotten all about his crime. At that point we can safely declare him insane and put him away in an army hospital, where he can live off the proceeds of his defense fund – quite substantial, no doubt – until he’s called to meet his Maker. Which is the only time we’ll see justice served in this case."
Justin believing a higher power. I guess I'm down with it in this case if he gets to share the same punishment as Christopher Hitchens. LOL.
gsealey
May 30th, 2012 at 2:24 am
I agree with Chris Hayes and with Justin that the use of the term 'heroes' for soldiers engaged in an unjust war is inappropriate. The term 'hero' denotes someone who has made a choice to do something of moral worth despite considerable difficulty or danger. Calling the soldiers 'heroes' clearly implies and is intended to imply that that the NATO occupation has moral worth. As to 'villains' , there are undoubtedly many of these in their ranks but most soldiers are, perhaps, victims of the corruption of their leaders and the ignorance and apathy of their fellow citizens.
DHC
May 30th, 2012 at 3:55 am
I once read somewhere that one cannot dislike war but still support the troops because it is akin to one not supporting the Mob but still supporting hitmen.
I grew up playing G.I. Joe, painiting everything I cam across camouflage, plaing plastic army men, running around with toy guns, watching Rambo and Missing in Action, etc. Then, like most, I matured beyond the fiction that war is fun. For those who chose to maintain being a soldier, er, a militant, must be rooted in a perverse desire to kill.
For death IS the natural consequence of war.
john
May 30th, 2012 at 4:11 am
They are not heroes, but they are not all villians, many of them are just a bunch of people who have internalized the propaganda put out by an electronic and print media that has abandoned the traditional watchdog role of the press. They are the one percent at the bottom who support the one percent at the top who are the real villians and psychopaths that benefit politically, socially, and financially from the endless wars. Blowhards like Romney, Trump, Bush, Cheney, Obama, Pelosis, and the whole gang who never wore the uniform and whose children will never be exposed to combat or forced to make the ultimate sacrifice, all talk about American excetionalism and the need to remake and reorder the world, while they create a gang of mass murderers to do do the dirty work.
Articles for Mid-Week » Scott Lazarowitz's Blog
May 30th, 2012 at 4:46 am
[...] Justin Raimondo: Heroes and Villains: Chris Hayes Shouldn’t Have Apologized [...]
KMH
May 30th, 2012 at 5:55 am
I am a Vietnam era vet. Myself and all the vets I know don't consider ourselves "heroes," we just did the job we were asked to do. The "heroes" business has nothing to do with us anyway. This is just about chickenhawk politics.
Johnny in Wi.
May 30th, 2012 at 6:33 am
This is one of Justin's best comments ever. The Pope has said that with modern weapons and modern war stratagies it is almost impossible to call any war just. I don't any war we have ever fought can really be called just. Even the Revolution was supported by only a minority of the population and King George seemed like a better ruler then the last 2 presidents named George.
Bob Roddis
May 30th, 2012 at 6:56 am
Where was the Republican outrage when Hayes gave us this piece of "progressive" Keynesian BS on "austerity"? And where was Hayes' apology?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908/vp/47331308#…
MvGuy
May 30th, 2012 at 7:01 am
"They are the one percent at the bottom who support the one percent at the top who are the real villains and psychopaths that benefit politically, socially, and financially from the endless wars."
Nice stuff………. john…. You have seen through all the blather and framed the situation accurately. Do the Germans honor and celebrate their former warriors of the Third Reich, Storm,Troopers and the S.S.???? Perhaps I, we should spotlight the prominent roll of the1% of humanity and our population best suited for imperial conquest… the psychopaths…. and even more useful to our new torture friendly lawless imperial minions…..the sadists…… Those who are sexually stimulated by the blood and mutilation of our hapless victims. They are terrorizing of the populations of so many places that I've lost track…….. What of the rape of children as their mothers were forced to watch discovered by Seymore Hirsh?? Senators Lieberman and Graham have been so helpful to bury the photos and videos of these rapes beyond reach of the courts… Should we celebrate them,too…????
Thomas L. Knapp
May 30th, 2012 at 7:03 am
"the army of our old republic, which served a strictly defensive function."
The ink wasn't dry on the Constitution before the US Army was knee-deep in offensive fuckery — bringing Pennsylvania's farmers to heel for the tax man, ethnically cleansing North America all the way to the Pacific, invading Mexico, suppressing secession, etc.
"The old republic" and its "defensive" military are figments of your imagination.
Mike
May 30th, 2012 at 7:14 am
There have always been armies and there will always be armies but the responsibility falls on the shoulders of the leadership. In America it is the civilians that take us to war. In this country if you want to stop war then stop the civilians. But don't negate the sacrifies these service people made, both dead and wounded. Obama is the one with the "Kill Lists". Almost every service person just wants to do their time in combat without getting killed or wounded and then get back to the states. Civilians develop and approve the rules of engagement. Any military member not following orders should be removed immediately.
MvGuy
May 30th, 2012 at 7:21 am
This [soldiers “heroes”] shibboleth is just one more little lie in the bulwarks of lies that this empire, formerly America, employs to keep us their willing accomplices ……and tax servants.
johnc
May 30th, 2012 at 7:46 am
I think the whole thing stinks of PR/psyops. not so long ago on there was uproar among libs when Fox news commentator Juan Williams said that he "was not comfortable" flying with muslims. What's up with people who lie to us on behalf of the-powers-that-be revealing their own ostensible thoughts only to condemned by "the community?' BTW I am "not comfortable" with the upcoming Bilderberger meeting in Chantilly Va.
Ben_C
May 30th, 2012 at 7:57 am
I haven't seen/heard too many actual combat troops strut around the nation on book tours boasting of their heroism lately. Some of these "combat troops" kill themselves…obviously because they are so 'proud'…. Maybe combat troops are bad writers, or maybe they're generally not celebrity material to begin with…to the point where even a ghost writer can't make their stories of "heroism" "mainstream". Who knows…
This might be a good time to address Korea, Viet Nam, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc… Even sociopath Bales was allegedly "upset" about being redeployed; or, at least his family was…
The loudest "voice" I've heard recently is Leon Panetta's–a man who's closet brush with "combat" was reading a text message allegedly from the head of Iran's Qods force while barking orders form his office in the"Green Zone" in Iraq…
I'd be interested in hearing what some of these combat troops really have to say; rather than what is said about them in order to exploit them…
If there is such thing as "troop worship" to begin with, obviously what they actually have to say should be "worth" something… Or maybe this is just another "diversion"… Who knows….
liberranter
May 30th, 2012 at 8:52 am
There is growing evidence the massacre wasn’t just an isolated incident, but part of a larger pattern of “no knock” retaliatory raids conducted by US troops in Afghanistan.
Which bear an uncomfortable similarity to those "no knock" raids being conducted here at home by our "domestic 'heroes in blue'", many of whom also honed their atrocity skills in places like Afghanistan and can't wait for the day when they can exercise them here with complete impunity.
Generalissimo X
May 30th, 2012 at 8:55 am
the only thing missing on the u.s. military equipment list is a copy of the german SS belt buckle that said "Gott mit Uns". i for one am sick to death of the slavish military (dictatorship) worship in what is a free republic. i went on a few msm blogs (big F-ing mistake) yesterday and all it was was rah rah rah u-s-a crapola. i got called a "traitor", a "commie" and i supposedly "love terrorists" because i intoned that our liberty comes from "god" and is guaranteed by the constitution not a standing military. i dared remind these bleating clowns that the founding fathers were against standing armies because of what they do to liberty and you'd thought i was advocating for hitler. this country is straight up doomed and there's no way back save utter financial and social destruction. these insipid mind controlled zombies have no ability to reason or figure out they're in a pig trap and the 4th wall is going to drop with a boom. and in the aftermath, just like in germany in the 30's and 40's there will be "no nazis" and everyone will say they were against this from day 1. all deluded liars.
Generalissimo X
May 30th, 2012 at 8:55 am
the only thing missing on the u.s. military equipment list is a copy of the german SS belt buckle that said "Gott mit Uns". i for one am sick to death of the slavish military (dictatorship) worship in what is a free republic. i went on a few msm blogs (big F-ing mistake) yesterday and all it was was rah rah rah u-s-a crapola. i got called a "traitor", a "commie" and i supposedly "love terrorists" because i intoned that our liberty comes from "god" and is guaranteed by the constitution not a standing military. i dared remind these bleating clowns that the founding fathers were against standing armies because of what they do to liberty and you'd thought i was advocating for hitler. this country is straight up doomed and there's no way back save utter financial and social destruction. these insipid mind controlled zombies have no ability to reason or figure out they're in a pig trap and the 4th wall is going to drop with a boom. and in the aftermath, just like in germany in the 30's and 40's there will be "no nazis" and everyone will say they were against this from day 1. all deluded liars.
Rusty
May 30th, 2012 at 9:08 am
Meanwhile, one could argue our experiment with Republicanism ended, and our Empire began, with the smashing and grab theft of half of Mexico
Of all the wars you could criticize you picked the one that was the most beneficial to the direct interests of the US and its people. The Mexican War was the best war, outside of our Revolution, that we ever conducted.
Generalissimo X
May 30th, 2012 at 9:21 am
obama has his kill lists. and it is active duty military (black ops) who do the murder. 'nuff said.
Thomas L. Knapp
May 30th, 2012 at 9:27 am
"Almost every service person just wants to do their time in combat without getting killed or wounded and then get back to the states."
My off-the-cuff reaction is "and almost every slave owner just wants the cotton picked so he can sell it and buy nice things .. your point?"
My more considered response is "I spent ten years in uniform as a Marine grunt, and I suspect you don't have the slightest idea what 'almost every service person' wants."
Mike Ehling
May 30th, 2012 at 10:52 am
Thanks for saving me the effort of writing my own response to Justin. This was largely what I was going to say. In reality, though, I'm not sure whether it began with Mexico or with the Louisiana Purchase, which was definitely an unconstitutional action by Jefferson's own standards, which expanded the national boundaries far beyond those contemplated by the original constitutional compact, and which left enormous new territory for Congress to govern with a resulting substantial increase in central national authority. I recall that Sherman (though I don't have my Library of America copy of his Memoirs immediately available to verify this) stated that secession could not be justified when the nation had been purchased with the money of all (Louisiana) and the blood of all (Mexico), so Sherman recognized (assumedly approvingly) the imperial expansion that began in 1803.
Lorraine
May 30th, 2012 at 11:47 am
"So they’re faced with a choice: get out, or get with the program". Well, those of you who know me can at least also know, I have faced my choice, and I am getting OUT. In the immortal words of Popeye, "I've had all I can stands, and I can't stands no more". "YOU KNOW WHO".
BlindCity
May 30th, 2012 at 12:09 pm
No one joins the military looking to kill civilians. They join because they believe and trusted in this country, its leaders and its people which has betrayed and forgotten them. You think they want to be there? You think they can just quit hop on a bus and just come home? Everyday is a struggle to survive. They go through starvation, fatigue and pain that you can't even contemplate. They are there in a world where men behead their opposition, castrate their women and strap bombs on children then send them our way by telling the poor kid we have candy. Unless you know the darkness that takes over your soul so you can have a fighting chance to hopefully see your home and family that you left at the age of 18. These men are heroes. It's the ones in washington who send them there with no plan no mission and no hope in sight that its going to end. It's all of you who sit on your thrones comfortably secure in your idleness while your fellow countrymen are dying
BlindCity
May 30th, 2012 at 12:36 pm
Just because their situation that they are put in isn't ideal it doesn't change the fact that they stood up and volunteered pausing their lives and knowingly put it at risk in belief and faith that it was for a good cause. They went so you wouldn't have too. They are Heroes and your opinions that have no merit won't ever change that
Oswaldwasalefty
May 30th, 2012 at 12:42 pm
I wasn't commenting on the merit, or lack of merit, of the U.S. War of Aggression Against Mexico, but simply stating that I think it marked the beginning the of the U.S. as an empire.
You just don't get it do you? Yeah, of course it "worked", and helped launch the rise of the U.S. as a modern industrial power. Germany's invasions of Poland and France "worked", and they did a much better job of managing them than, say, the U.S. in Afghanistan and Iraq. So what? Wars of aggression are illegitimate methods of engaging in trade. The U.S. Navy directly links what it does in its advertising to U.S. global trade policy. Of course, that makes it "A Force For Good In The World".
BlindCity
May 30th, 2012 at 12:54 pm
Just because their situation isn't ideal it doesn't change the fact they they put their lives on hold and knowingly at risk in the belief and faith that their cause was for good and the protection of the people. They stood up and went so you wouldn't have too. These men are Heroes and your opinions that hold no merit can't change that.
Duglarri
May 30th, 2012 at 1:03 pm
Don't forget the unsuccessful attempt to grab Canada while Britain was distracted by that little matter of the Napoleonic wars in 1812. That war did have the "beneficial" effect of destroying the treaty-protected Indian nations that occupied the whole center of the continent and blocked westward expansion.
Duglarri
May 30th, 2012 at 1:06 pm
Gott Mit Uns was on every German soldier's belt buckle in 1914. I don't think it was on SS buckles, because the Nazis were of course militantly anti-Christian.
Philippe
May 30th, 2012 at 1:11 pm
Can it be possible that you STILL don't get it? They do those things to "us" because we have invaded their country. We are the invaders, we are the invaders, we are the invaders, we are the invaders, we are the invaders, etc.
Duglarri
May 30th, 2012 at 1:12 pm
"They stood up and went so you wouldn't have to" – I don't think that's quite right. They didn't put their lives on hold: the army is their life. This is what they chose to do.
And while I can't speak for all, I do know of servicemen who joined because they like guns, and look forward to the opportunity to shoot people. Some people like shooting people.
I will cite a source. James Matthis, current commander of the US Central Command.
"You go into Afghanistan, you got guys who slap women around for five years, because they didn't wear a veil," Mattis said. "You know guys like that ain't got no manhood left anyway. So it's a hell of a lot of fun to shoot 'em."
I'm not sure that makes him a hero. Seems to me that there's an argument that it makes him a giggling, dangerous psychopath.
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/federal-eye/2010…
wars r u.s.
May 30th, 2012 at 1:29 pm
Bring back the draft and everybody start hating the troops like during the Viet Nam era and wars will disappear. The war machine got smart. It doesn't matter if the majority of the people are against war just as long as they support the huggable troops. Try to watch a sporting event without the cameras picking up someone in some uniform and gushing how they are keeping us safe. Imagine that happening in 1969.
wars r u.s.
May 30th, 2012 at 1:30 pm
So which post should I puke upon?
Generalissimo X
May 30th, 2012 at 1:57 pm
welllllll it still happens (dead civilians) doesn't it? the road to hell is paved with good intentions, and the u.s. soldier is laying most of the bricks these days. heroes are people who take a stand against tyranny and do something beyond themselves. shooting up afghans, iraqis, etc. etc. at the behest of your corporate/gov't master isn't heroic. it's dog like servile behavior which is frankly unconscionable. heroic would them laying down their weapons and refusing to engage in the slaughter. heroic is bradley manning who reported crimes he saw. a coward is bales who murdered people at kept following orders that he knew were immoral and illegal. that's a monster in my book. as for the draft, keep dreaming. they could pass a draft tomorrow and every neo-con pig and senator's son would get a deferment just like they did back in the day. a draft would ensure more wholesale destruction of our youth, not "share the burden". the elites never share, they only steal, for our own good of course.
John Fordham
May 30th, 2012 at 2:05 pm
Hallelujah! I thank God for Justin, for saying what needs to be said. I've said to myself often in these dark war years, 'This would not be possible without the blind, unquestioning obedience of the sainted troops'. The US condemned people at Nuremberg whose defense was 'just following orders'. At least the Nazis were fighting for their own people. Our military personnel are most definitely not fighting for the defense and freedom of the American people. They are in the service of war profiteers, Israeli expansion, etc. I'm sorry, but they clearly do not deserve our support. Thanks also, Justin, for skewering the unspeakably hideous and smart-alecky Ms Coulter.
Doug_in_Indiana
May 30th, 2012 at 6:03 pm
I wouldn't know about the SS, but my Dad brought home a German belt and buckle in 1945 from Europe inscribed "Gott Mitt Uns'.
Ben_C
May 30th, 2012 at 7:00 pm
I guess as a side note: gays can now openly serve in the US military while participating in night raids or being blown up by an IEDs. That was certainly a long hard fought battle…as I'm sure many can remember. Perhaps Iran's Revolutionary Guard and Qods force will follow suit to in order compete.
Maybe, maybe not… however, according to a recent Reuters 'news' report, the Iranians have their own pet project of training female ninja assassins. I assume these ladies are being trained to judo kick any bunker busters dropped by US and/or Israeli jets out to the sky and back to Tel Aviv and/or Washington DC if a bombing campaign on Iran's "nuclear program" is ever attempted…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRScWbcrXR4
We could be in some serious trouble now…
Ben_C
May 30th, 2012 at 7:00 pm
I guess as a side note: gays can now openly serve in the US military while participating in night raids or being blown up by an IEDs. That was certainly a long hard fought battle…as I'm sure many can remember. Perhaps Iran's Revolutionary Guard and Qods force will follow suit in order to compete.
Maybe, maybe not… however, according to a recent Reuters 'news' report, the Iranians have their own pet project of training female ninja assassins. I assume these ladies are being trained to judo kick any bunker busters dropped by US and/or Israeli jets out to the sky and back to Tel Aviv and/or Washington DC if a bombing campaign on Iran's "nuclear program" is ever attempted…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRScWbcrXR4
We could be in some serious trouble now…
JJJihad
May 30th, 2012 at 8:04 pm
The large majority of those who join the service have little or no real economic choice or personal resources to do much else. Most of the rest join due to various mental illnesses, such as patriotism or simpleminded belief in other American myths.
Mr Raimando makes it rather easy for himself that we should disrespect our "heroes" by imputing sadistic motives to servicemen and women. The fact is that, except for a few true lunatics and psychopaths, almost all service people want nothing to do with war or combat or conquest or any of the shit.
Once you accept that, it becomes much harder to treat them with contempt in order to put an end to the nonsensical myth-making glory and valor propaganda that makes war possible.
It is easy to spit into the eye of a monster. It is a lot harder to do that too some poor dumb-ass low-normal no prospect rube who has wound up a mental and physical ruin thanks to fighting a US/Israeli war "in country" somewhere. (We might as well start calling it, "in world.") But that is what is necessary. If the heroism-glory-honor tripe is to be stopped, you have to treat these poor losers who were doomed from birth as murderous scumbags, deserving of our disgust and abhorrence rather than "pride." Not very charitable, but the alternative is the extinction of homo sapiens sapiens within 40 or 50 years.
Rusty
May 30th, 2012 at 8:12 pm
The land we acquired in 1848 was sparsely populated, i.e. virtually empty, with no other nation having any more legitimate claim to it than us. If you really think we stole that land, then what about the Mexicans? How did they come of it? They commandeered it from the Spanish who took it from the Natives. Mexico only claimed that land for 30 years before we took it from them. Not exactly a long time to establish a valid claim.
While Germany invaded areas of Europe that were occupied with millions of other Europeans who had built and developed civilizations on those lands, the US, Mexico, Spain, France, Britain, Russia and others were having a free-for-all in a vast virgin wilderness occupied by a handful of hunter gatherers. Many nations made claims in the New World, and those claims were settled either politically or through the final extension of politics, war.
Now that we have 7 billion people on Earth, I doubt any nation will ever have that chance again to grab vast tracts of virgin land. I suppose this could happen in Antarctica, but given the distances involved, no nation would have as easy a go at it as we did in 1848.
PS
I hear people all the time lament that the US stole its land. Yet I never hear that talk about any other New World nation, except of course Anglo Canada and Australia. Why is that? Also, If Mexico still possessed that land today would people denounce them for stealing it from the Spanish and natives? I doubt it.
Ben_C
May 31st, 2012 at 12:56 am
I think it can understandably rub people the wrong way when they perceive war (organized death) being glorified in some way. No, the troops are not "heroes". Some are disgusting human beings going into the military, others are perfectly sane and social members of society going in…this mix of personalities is typically true with any large organization. Many troops, however, do disgusting things while serving….this is what war is.
I think one of the huge problems we have as a society, even a "global community", is this seemingly 'shared' and accepted 'romantic' notion of war–an "idea" which compels many to do things such as create and agree on "rules" of war in order to establish the "noble" way to conduct war, as opposed to "barbarism" and simply organized murder–which is what war actually is.. This 'romanticism', and the associated efforts to establish and preserve "noble war", in turn masks the true nature of it…which, in turn, makes war "acceptable", or at the very least "tolerable", to the domestic population–most of who will never know war and are also expected to respect and abide by domestic law, as well as consider the state worthy of enforcing it.
This 'romanticism' goes back a long way, and is a separate issue, but I personally think the only war "worth" fighting is one where the overwhelming population would cheer if troops killed the "enemy" and subsequently urinated on their corpses and even finishing it off by defecating on their faces….Not only cheer this, but also breathe a sigh of relieve at the same time. I think this is a fairly straight-forward and appropriate watermark IMHO. I'm sure this notation may be somewhat controversial, even (possibly especially) here, but it seems to make the most sense to me…just think about it…. Why else would/should war be organized and carried out other than to completely "destroy" the "enemy"? There's nothing "noble" or "civilized" about war in the first place, and perpetuating an illusion(s) otherwise only compounds 'problems' IMHO.
Anyway…separate issue. I do think "Memorial Day" is important…most people don't think about war or foreign policy much, if at all, to begin with. So at least Memorial day provides and 'opportunity' for a "discussion" people (other than those who do on a regular basis anyway) may actually participate in…an "opportunity" I consider to be better than nothing, or simply business as usual .
I mainly view this "hero" crap as typical lame-stream superficial meaningless banter. It doesn't really mean anything to the people saying it, or even to most "listening" to it in the first place: therefore, it doesn't really bother me. The lame-stream does this (for the most part that is) mainly because 'they' 'think it's what they're supposed to do. It's like wearing green on St. Patties day, or even more accurately like saying: "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas" or "Happy Hanukkah" during the Month of December so as to avoid potentially"offending" anyone, while spreading the "holiday cheer" at the same time. I don't see any real significance beyond this. The lame-stream is the "lame-stream"…it is what it is. There's no getting around this.
Ben_C
May 31st, 2012 at 12:57 am
(…)
I do, however, see another use, but it's not the "lame-stream" for the most part IMHO. It seems to me some warmongers have realized this "conversation" can "stir things up" and can be used to their advantage. I don't really see it being used as a whip to further an agenda per say (I assume they're smart to know people opposed to their agenda would never actually buy into their crap in the first place); rather, I see them using it as a distraction…a self-perpetuating distraction. It's exactly like when they play the "anti-Semitism" or "patriotism" card…etc… I'm fairly sure many (if not all) who incite this kind of thing don't even believe half the crap that comes out of their own mouths…but they know the more people get worked up and talk about these things, the more the debate will shift that way and, in turn, shift away from the real issues at hand–which will eventually be obscured and/or conflated. For example: I suspect the Iran "issue" to become more and more centered around "preserving Israeli's right to exist" and probably be framed in some way as a question of America's tolerance of Iran's supposed attempt exterminate all Jews from the face of the earth, while initiating an global nuclear war in the process… The closer we get to this conflict, I expect the farther away the debate will shift from a discussion about Iran's actual capability of producing a Nuke in the first place, much less what they would, or even "could", do with a nuke if they in fact produced one. I'm guessing a serious "debate" considering the potential (real) costs of initiating a War with Iran and what it would mean for us here, will be completely glossed over and/or ignored all together for the most part. The shift in the discourse will not be random, and may even be unnoticed by most.
Oswaldwasalefty
May 31st, 2012 at 1:09 am
"…The land we acquired in 1848 was sparsely populated, i.e. virtually empty, with no other nation having any more legitimate claim to it than us…."
Are you talking about Mexico in 1848, or Palestine 1948, here? Ah, the claims of imperialists never change, do they? The "sparsely populated" land apologetics in defense of imperialist aggression is getting really old. And East Timor had only a population of 600,000 when the U.S. backed Indonesian invasion occurred, so it wasn't really that bad to kill up to 1/3 of the population back in the late '70's, blah, blah, blah.
I'm American. It's my job to be honest about our history and oppose the criminality of our own government. Besides it's the most powerful military state ever, and is guided by the kind of dangerous hubris one expect the most powerful military ever to have.
Only the imperialist hypocritic demands that we look outward and point to the behavior of others.
james
May 31st, 2012 at 1:28 am
Personally, I would call the Afghani resistance or Mujahideen the real heroes. They truly engage their far superior enemy almost daily with only their machine guns, grenades and launchers along with their legendary determination. I am not talking about the suicide bombers who blow up people here, I think most of them are occupation implants.
In all honesty, who would be the hero in most people's eyes?
Rusty
May 31st, 2012 at 7:23 am
And how did Mexico come of that land?
Oswaldwasalefty
May 31st, 2012 at 11:36 am
I'm not a Mexican citizen hypocrite. I'm an American citizen. If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, then it must be a duck. A war of aggression is a war of aggression, whether we do it, or Germany does it.
Speaking if Germany, I'm sure somewhere along the way the Russian people committed genocide against more than one nation in forging their large nation, but that doesn't diminish the criminality of the German invasion of the Soviet Union during World War II. If there is one lesson we should have learned from World War II, it is to look at ourselves in the mirror and see the reflection of our own governments in the mirror. And the reflection we see back is the most powerful military state in world history. So our responsibility is even greater than it is for people living in countries with less powerful states.
P.S. I'm certainly not entertaining a return of the land to Mexico, or even to the indigenous population. I'm simply saying that no such even as the "Mexican-American War" happened. Complete fiction. It was the U.S. War Of Aggression Against Mexico. If an official enemy of the U.S. had just behaved in the same way, like Iraq taking Kuwait, then we call it exactly the same thing.
Yes, I'm aware that the origins of the modern nation of "Mexico" dates back to the conquest of a previous Empire. If was wrong for Spain, Portugal, the Netherlands, Belgium, France, Britain, Germany, Italy, and Japan, to build empires using aggressive militarism, then it is wrong for us NOW.
chmch
May 31st, 2012 at 8:20 pm
Military is the religion of this nation, the holy symbols, the flag, the eagle, the hero soldier/protector priest, the Pentagon/Vatican, an unquestioning faith in our mission, parades and speeches and little flag pins on every lapel. I wish for a National Apology Day, when we honor our troops by apologizing to them for wasting their courage, abusing their trust, exploiting their naive devotion to a false creed of American nationalism.
Outsider
June 1st, 2012 at 11:13 am
Although, as a libertarian, I don't like the idea of a military draft, in the case of the imperial US, its continuation would have helped to prevent our recent wars of empire. I'm a vet of the Vietnam era. The existence of the draft back then had as much to do with the massive protests, which helped to end the war, as the war itself. Without a draft it appears impossible for such massive protests to arise. Hence, it is easy for the US to continue these wars.
R.K.
June 2nd, 2012 at 10:00 am
Great post and very true. Spain explored, claimed and controlled that land long before Mexico as a sovereign country even came into being. Therefore, if the United States is supposed to give that land back to anyone, it should be Spain and not Mexico.
Not that we should give that land back to anyone. The United States fought a battle with Mexico for that land and the United States won, Mexico lost. The United States also paid Mexico a monetary compensation for that land although it wasn't necessary to do so as the U.S. was the victor.
Still, I guess it doesn't matter as our borders have been deliberately left open for 30 years or so and the entire United States is going to be a replica of Mexico in 40 years if not sooner.
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